↗ Live site
Preview: a read-only copy of the forum. To post or reply, use the current forum.

Reincarnation

560 posts · 25 participants · started Jun 2, 2017, 2:41 PM

  1. Hi urantia4me!

    No where in the UB does it suggest that humanity MUST listen to dis-embodied voices, and many people figure that out for themselves when spirit gravity sucks them in – LOL

    I prefer to stay in my lane, so to speak.  The Atonement Doctrine has got to go – long over due.

    USA has only produced “greed is good” and “what is torture?” as the official with-us-or-against-us Patriot Act unelected government “philosophy for living”.

    People in India have a longer tradition of asking the question Who/why are we?  And no civilization would actually be a civilization if it ignored the FACT that this planet is a Nursery of Life Forms, if you will.

    I always like to get back to a major character in the drama of the First Human Species – Amadon – whenever it’s “time to roll up the pant legs, because it is too late to save the shoes” of a pile of pharisaism bs PROJECTED as “politics”.

    Life is in OUR HUMAN HANDS to cherish and nurture.  We can do it MUCH BETTER than the luciferians….game on. It just gets so vicious because “technically it is not illegal”…

     

  2. Wow! I go away for a few days and what interesting comments I find when I come back! So in order of the replies…Bradly, you never disappoint when it comes to such pointed & thoughtful comments. You always remind me that I have so much more to learn (and occasionally re-read) in the UB. Hello again to Paul – funny how we keep coming back to the UB when comparing it to other sources of info. There are levels of depth & clarity in the UB that other metaphysical sources cannot quite match. And I find it quite interesting that New Age gurus do NOT provide good answers when asked why the UB contradicts New Age teachings. They sound good only up to a point. And then comes the response that I ask too many questions! But if their material was absolutely true, then it should withstand honest, rigorous questioning. But like you all have said, reincarnation is a somewhat more reasonable idea than “one life, then final judgement”. Now to NamelessUntilFused, I have looked politics from various perspectives, and in the past, likely shared similar thoughts. But honestly, not only true for this forum, but for life in general, I find it best not to bring up politics (and religion) except in private conversations with people you know and trust. I used to welcome debates with people on both subjects, but ultimately, the debates were at best a stalemate. At worst, people become more entrenched in their positions, resenting those with opposing views. So I found that nothing ultimately good came from the many debates I engaged in. Besides, now I find that I have mix of thoughtful opinions on various subjects so that I can find some things agreeable to discuss with people on different sides of the political (& religious) spectrums, and there’s a better chance good coming from such interactions. So, consider that if we can bring together people (with diverse views on many other subjects) to actually agree on reading, studying and discussing the Urantia Book, then we have accomplished something well-worth our time & effort! So going back a few of the UB quotes that Bradly sited, it’s good to know that those beings who produced the UB know very well how frustrating life can be at times, causing us a whole ranging of emotional outbursts and negative thoughts. And those beings took the time to remind us that life in the grand scheme is moving in the overall desired direction, so we should allow ourselves to lose our minds or self-control. Things do get sorted out eventually for us, though it may not happen during our short lives on Earth. In the meantime, I try keep reminding myself that everyone has a mix of traits & ideas that I would label good or bad, depending on my current ways of thinking. Some people I would NEVER want to hang out with, but that doesn’t mean they are pure evil scumbags. Even within our individual collection of thoughts, I can almost guarantee that we each periodically have some contradictory thoughts, which we may or may not be aware of. Also, I bet everyone can think something they believed 10 years ago but now have a very different belief. It’s like when we are teenagers, we may have thought our parents were really stupid in some. Then as you grow older by 30 years or more (& hopefully wiser), when you have kids of your own, you realize your knew more than you previously thought. And moreover, they actually accomplished more with less compared to our respective generations. Kids today are very technologically advanced compared to when I was a kid, but youth will always lack some common sense that can only come from having a variety of life experiences, which I have had. I had to explain that to a younger friend of mine recently who mistakenly thought I was implying that he is not a smart as me. I told him it was only the fact that I have had more years than him to seriously ponder and test ideas, including my own. Nothing more than that. So now our friendship is repaired, even though he differs politically from me. But now he realizes that I honestly weigh the pros & cons for all ideas and then draw conclusions. 10 years from now, he may take a big interest in my current beliefs about things, but by then, I may have moved on to other interests, adjusting my beliefs yet again. I guess what I’m suggesting is to try to be a little more understanding with people we currently disagree with, for someday we may find that we will actually agree on a few things after some life experiences reshape our thinking. Bye for now.

  3. Correction to my prior post: “we should NOT allow ourselves to lose our minds or lose our self-control.”

  4. Another correction: “You eventually realize that your parents knew more than you previously thought.” (I really should proofread before submitting my posts.)

  5. Urantia4me,

    Studying the UB is certainly a challenge, for sure! What has emerged helpful for me is a simple question: What is this author really telling me? It has led to increased interest in listening with an open mind, such as I suspect you are doing with your reading. Perhaps the top number one most important question for all life (nothing exempted) is only three words: What is true? (Or what is real?)

    We learn from the UB the Universal Paradise Father God is the Truth. This person provides and we are privileged to discover! We gain a little bit daily, more later on the Mansion Worlds and then still more later in our universe career then onward for more truth!

    Wonderful, this plan from the Trinity Team!

     

  6. Michael/urantia4me – when you are logged in there should be an “Edit” button at the top left of your own posts which is there for 1- 2 days to allow such corrections within the original post.  I can read my own mistakes sometimes and still not see them somehow!

    I agree about personal contemporary political opinions and commentary – they are simply out of place here and irrelevant to the subject matter and purpose of the community here.  We discover and discuss a profound textbook on the origins, meanings, and destiny of life.

    To engage in rhetorical and persuasive arguments for or against local politics or politicians or conservative vs. liberal blame and guilt or “solutions” and to assign blame to secular institutions for personal political frustrations, disappointments, and anxieties only diminishes the discovery and discussion and our purpose here and completely misses the point and the contents of the Papers.

    We have a specific purpose here which unifies perspective and gives a compass point for our mutual focus, as Mark points out so well above.  What is true and real in the universe and in our life…according to the contents of the Papers?  None here are required to believe or agree with those teachings and we may certainly compare and contrast our own and others’ beliefs TO the claims of the Papers authors.

    But our claims and representations about the Papers are certainly subject to scrutiny, discussion, and debate.  And personal politics are never appropriate or even relevant and the political agreement or disagreement by others is just as irrelevant and inappropriate too.

    But….the causes and solutions for blame, personal disappointments, frustration, anxieties, fears, doubts, suspicions, and pessimism certainly ARE topics presented in the UB.  These are the very point and purpose of the UB…to identify and specify the causes and the solutions for all such blindness,  impatience,  ignorance, subjectivity, myopic perspective, false beliefs,  superstitions, and mortal immaturity.

    Doubts and fears are contrasted with faith, hope, and trust in the UB.  Ignorance is salved by information and insight.  Truth is served to those who can discern it and patiently awaits those who cannot yet utilize it until they can do so by greater context and perspective delivered by experiential wisdom attainment.

    :good:

    "Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."

  7. There are levels of depth & clarity in the UB that other metaphysical sources cannot quite match. And I find it quite interesting that New Age gurus do NOT provide good answers when asked why the UB contradicts New Age teachings. They sound good only up to a point. And then comes the response that I ask too many questions! But if their material was absolutely true, then it should withstand honest, rigorous questioning. But like you all have said, reincarnation is a somewhat more reasonable idea than “one life, then final judgement”. Now to NamelessUntilFused, I have looked politics from various perspectives, and in the past, likely shared similar thoughts. But honestly, not only true for this forum, but for life in general, I find it best not to bring up politics (and religion) except in private conversations with people you know and trust. I used to welcome debates with people on both subjects, but ultimately, the debates were at best a stalemate. At worst, people become more entrenched in their positions, resenting those with opposing views. So I found that nothing ultimately good came from the many debates I engaged in. Besides, now I find that I have mix of thoughtful opinions on various subjects so that I can find some things agreeable to discuss with people on different sides of the political (& religious) spectrums, and there’s a better chance good coming from such interactions. So, consider that if we can bring together people (with diverse views on many other subjects) to actually agree on reading, studying and discussing the Urantia Book, then we have accomplished something well-worth our time & effort! So going back a few of the UB quotes that Bradly sited, it’s good to know that those beings who produced the UB know very well how frustrating life can be at times, causing us a whole ranging of emotional outbursts and negative thoughts. And those beings took the time to remind us that life in the grand scheme is moving in the overall desired direction, so we should allow ourselves to lose our minds or self-control. Things do get sorted out eventually for us, though it may not happen during our short lives on Earth. In the meantime, I try keep reminding myself that everyone has a mix of traits & ideas that I would label good or bad, depending on my current ways of thinking. Some people I would NEVER want to hang out with, but that doesn’t mean they are pure evil scumbags. Even within our individual collection of thoughts, I can almost guarantee that we each periodically have some contradictory thoughts, which we may or may not be aware of. Also, I bet everyone can think something they believed 10 years ago but now have a very different belief. It’s like when we are teenagers, we may have thought our parents were really stupid in some. Then as you grow older by 30 years or more (& hopefully wiser), when you have kids of your own, you realize your knew more than you previously thought. And moreover, they actually accomplished more with less compared to our respective generations. Kids today are very technologically advanced compared to when I was a kid, but youth will always lack some common sense that can only come from having a variety of life experiences, which I have had. I had to explain that to a younger friend of mine recently who mistakenly thought I was implying that he is not a smart as me. I told him it was only the fact that I have had more years than him to seriously ponder and test ideas, including my own. Nothing more than that. So now our friendship is repaired, even though he differs politically from me. But now he realizes that I honestly weigh the pros & cons for all ideas and then draw conclusions. 10 years from now, he may take a big interest in my current beliefs about things, but by then, I may have moved on to other interests, adjusting my beliefs yet again. I guess what I’m suggesting is to try to be a little more understanding with people we currently disagree with, for someday we may find that we will actually agree on a few things after some life experiences reshape our thinking.

    Nicely put.  Thank you. :good:

  8. Thank you Mara. And yes, Mark – that is one of the most important questions to ask, for a variety of reasons. I had more to write but I lost it when I got interrupted by a phone call. Bradly, thanks for reminding me of the edit function, & thanks for reminding all of us how the UB addresses many of humanity’s concerns – real, specific knowledge (in the UB) is comforting, perhaps even more than someone simply saying “Everything will be alright”. It’s late so I better go for now.

  9. Hello Bradly,

    It was fitting that you quoted from the Forward section of the UB – just days before your reply, I reread the Forward to see if I could more fully grasp it since the first time I read it when I first bought the book; now I understand it. So now I have been reading the Papers dealing with the life of Jesus – I love all the details, since the Bible provides very little in comparison to the UB. Around ages 28-29, Jesus gave very interesting details on time, space & reality. In that same section, he also answered the often-asked question, “If God is good, why does He allow evil?” Jesus also explained how/why animals do not have souls, from which his student from India logically concluded that the transmigration of human souls into animals is untrue. Bye for now.

  10. Greetings Michael!!!

    Yes indeed…the universe reality facts presented in the UB are so completely assuring and comforting to its students and believers.   Epochal Revelations are the primary source of such knowledge on all material, evolutionary worlds….and such information reduces confusion and eliminates superstition more effectively even than mortal science, which also does eventually correct the primitive perspectives related to causes and effects.

    Epochal Revelation is intended to be a successive aggregation of expanding knowledge presented to the mortals of each world over time based evolutionary and experiential progress.  Similarly,  individuals are exposed to increasing education over the entirety of the ascendent experience.

    So glad to have you here sharing in the group discovery and study of the Papers.  Your sincerity inspires and your insights are appreciated by others here…including me!

    :good:

    0:12.11 (16.8) In formulating the succeeding presentations having to do with the portrayal of the character of the Universal Father and the nature of his Paradise associates, together with an attempted description of the perfect central universe and the encircling seven superuniverses, we are to be guided by the mandate of the superuniverse rulers which directs that we shall, in all our efforts to reveal truth and co-ordinate essential knowledge, give preference to the highest existing human concepts pertaining to the subjects to be presented. We may resort to pure revelation only when the concept of presentation has had no adequate previous expression by the human mind.

    0:12.12 (17.1) Successive planetary revelations of divine truth invariably embrace the highest existing concepts of spiritual values as a part of the new and enhanced co-ordination of planetary knowledge. Accordingly, in making these presentations about God and his universe associates, we have selected as the basis of these papers more than one thousand human concepts representing the highest and most advanced planetary knowledge of spiritual values and universe meanings. Wherein these human concepts, assembled from the God-knowing mortals of the past and the present, are inadequate to portray the truth as we are directed to reveal it, we will unhesitatingly supplement them, for this purpose drawing upon our own superior knowledge of the reality and divinity of the Paradise Deities and their transcendent residential universe.

    101:4.5 (1109.6) Truth may be but relatively inspired, even though revelation is invariably a spiritual phenomenon. While statements with reference to cosmology are never inspired, such revelations are of immense value in that they at least transiently clarify knowledge by:

    101:4.6 (1109.7) 1. The reduction of confusion by the authoritative elimination of error.

    101:4.7 (1109.8) 2. The co-ordination of known or about-to-be-known facts and observations.

    101:4.8 (1110.1) 3. The restoration of important bits of lost knowledge concerning epochal transactions in the distant past.

    101:4.9 (1110.2) 4. The supplying of information which will fill in vital missing gaps in otherwise earned knowledge.

    101:4.10 (1110.3) 5. Presenting cosmic data in such a manner as to illuminate the spiritual teachings contained in the accompanying revelation.

    5. Religion Expanded by Revelation

    101:5.1 (1110.4) Revelation is a technique whereby ages upon ages of time are saved in the necessary work of sorting and sifting the errors of evolution from the truths of spirit acquirement.

    101:5.2 (1110.5) Science deals with facts; religion is concerned only with values. Through enlightened philosophy the mind endeavors to unite the meanings of both facts and values, thereby arriving at a concept of complete reality. Remember that science is the domain of knowledge, philosophy the realm of wisdom, and religion the sphere of the faith experience.

     

    Me here:  We are told that the facts of cosmology and the historical record are never “inspired”.  They are true but they are not “truth” per se.  They are facts of knowledge, not relative truths with personalized meanings and values.  But such factual knowledge of reality is profoundly important in its effect on context, perspective,  and the philosophy of living!!

    ;-)

    "Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."

  11. Thank you all who have tried to clarify (or at times correct) my understanding (& the understanding of others who had good questions/comments) of the UB; it has been helpful. The more I read the UB, the more it clarifies (or at times corrects) not only what I have read in the Bible (which you all likely know how well the UB does that), but also the UB does the same for several of the metaphysical/new age books that I have read! I just finished reading Paper 113 (which Mara recommended to someone else) & Paper 114 (which covers related topics). I also have a better understanding of the relationship between the 7 Psychic Circles (which Bonita recommended to me) & the 7 Mansion Worlds, for the UB states that the human struggles to advance in the psychic circles on Earth are continued on the Mansion Worlds for those who reached a certain level of achievement at the time of their respective deaths. Be aware that the UB seems to suggest that the majority of humans who die before reaching the 3rd psychic circle while alive on their planets of origin will likely be spending a good deal of time in the “transition worlds” before being resurrected on the Mansion Worlds, which makes sense to me. But I would like others on this forum to comment on something odd I read in Paper 114. The UB says there are currently 900+ living mortals on Urantia who are “unconsciously” being prepared for global emergencies (by various entities) as the Reserve Corp of Destiny. I know what I think of that – it truly clarifies for me something oddly related that I read in a book by Dolores Cannon. (Just curious to know how you all think that “unconscious preparation” is occurring from our human point of view.) It is comforting to know from the UB (& other books I have read) that we humans will NOT be able to drastically change the beneficial course of evolution on our planet, despite all the current risks facing humanity & the Earth. Blessings.

  12. Hello again. I would also like to know anyone’s thoughts on what are the Transition Worlds and what happens on them? Is it safe to assume that it the Transition Worlds are for those human souls who never reached the 3rd psychic circle while alive on their planets of origin? The UB makes clear that some personalities won’t survive to experience resurrection on the Mansion Worlds. Are the ones who survive the Transition Worlds the same who must wait until the end of the current age to resurrect on the Mansion Worlds, which can take up to 1000+ years? I’m going to speculate that the Transition Worlds are the UB’s clarification/correction to the imperfect doctrine of Purgatory. (One more interesting thing since Halloween recently passed – read Paper 134, Section 8, to see what Jesus encountered on Mt Hermon – beings that some would classify as parnormal, but the UB confirms their reality, though my personal belief is that it’s highly unlikely that we would ever perceive such beings!)

  13. No…not related to any level of ascenders or purgatory Michael.  These are the engineering and mechanical worlds which design morontial levels which facilitate the progressive physical/spiritual transformation for all transcenders.

    Paper 48 describes these worlds in some detail.

    48:2.1 (542.5) These unique beings are exclusively concerned with the supervision of those activities which represent a working combination of spiritual and physical or semimaterial energies. They are exclusively devoted to the ministry of morontia progression. Not that they so much minister to mortals during the transition experience, but they rather make possible the transition environment for the progressing morontia creatures. They are the channels of morontia power which sustain and energize the morontia phases of the transition worlds.

    48:6.2 (551.7) You should understand that the morontia life of an ascending mortal is really initiated on the inhabited worlds at the conception of the soul, at that moment when the creature mind of moral status is indwelt by the spirit Adjuster. And from that moment on, the mortal soul has potential capacity for supermortal function, even for recognition on the higher levels of the morontia spheres of the local universe.

    48:6.1 (551.6) While all orders of angels, from the planetary helpers to the supreme seraphim, minister on the morontia worlds, the transition ministers are more exclusively assigned to these activities. These angels are of the sixth order of seraphic servers, and their ministry is devoted to facilitating the transit of material and mortal creatures from the temporal life in the flesh on into the early stages of morontia existence on the seven mansion worlds.

    48:8.1 (557.16) From the time of graduation from the mansion worlds to the attainment of spirit status in the superuniverse career, ascending mortals are denominated morontia progressors. Your passage through this wonderful borderland life will be an unforgettable experience, a charming memory. It is the evolutionary portal to spirit life and the eventual attainment of creature perfection by which ascenders achieve the goal of time—the finding of God on Paradise.

     

    Me here:  Let me repeat…thanks for being here.  Your sincerity, dedication, and open mind are wonderful aids in our mutual discovery of the Papers.

    "Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."

  14. Hello Bradly – Thank you; it’s nice to be in the forum. Along with your recent helpful comments quoting from Paper 48 (which I will likely read the whole chapter soon), I just finished reading Paper 49 regarding The Inhabited Worlds, which also surprisingly helped to clarify & correct my prior expressed thoughts. Apparently, those who don’t survive to continue onward to the Mansion Worlds were those who had no realistic chance of connecting with their Thought Adjusters, perhaps due to some kind of defect. Even the ones who must wait 1000 years still resurrect & reconnect with their Thought Adjusters on the Mansion Worlds, even if they did not progress very far through the psychic circles. I suppose someone would have to be very resistant & rebellious on the Mansion Worlds in order lose their soul’s opportunities to make progress. As long as we are willing to work toward the main goal of becoming more like God in healthy ways, then we will continue to progress in the afterlife. Bye for now.

  15. I agree that potentials are precious and mercy is extended until potential is exhausted. A Thought Adjuster is proof of soul and potential….

    28:6.5 (314.4) 2. The Memory of Mercy. These are the actual, full and replete, living records of the mercy which has been extended to individuals and races by the tender ministrations of the instrumentalities of the Infinite Spirit in the mission of adapting the justice of righteousness to the status of the realms, as disclosed by the portrayals of the Significance of Origins. The Memory of Mercy discloses the moral debt of the children of mercy—their spiritual liabilities—to be set down against their assets of the saving provision established by the Sons of God. In revealing the Father’s pre-existent mercy, the Sons of God establish the necessary credit to insure the survival of all. And then, in accordance with the findings of the Significance of Origins, a mercy credit is established for the survival of each rational creature, a credit of lavish proportions and one of sufficient grace to insure the survival of every soul who really desires divine citizenship.

    28:6.6 (314.5) The Memory of Mercy is a living trial balance, a current statement of your account with the supernatural forces of the realms. These are the living records of mercy ministration which are read into the testimony of the courts of Uversa when each individual’s right to unending life comes up for adjudication, when “thrones are cast up and the Ancients of Days are seated. The broadcasts of Uversa issue and come forth from before them; thousands upon thousands minister to them, and ten thousand times ten thousand stand before them. The judgment is set, and the books are opened.” And the books which are opened on such a momentous occasion are the living records of the tertiary seconaphim of the superuniverses. The formal records are on file to corroborate the testimony of the Memories of Mercy if they are required.

    28:6.7 (314.6) The Memory of Mercy must show that the saving credit established by the Sons of God has been fully and faithfully paid out in the loving ministry of the patient personalities of the Third Source and Center. But when mercy is exhausted, when the “memory” thereof testifies to its depletion, then does justice prevail and righteousness decree. For mercy is not to be thrust upon those who despise it; mercy is not a gift to be trampled under foot by the persistent rebels of time. Nevertheless, though mercy is thus precious and dearly bestowed, your individual drawing credits are always far in excess of your ability to exhaust the reserve if you are sincere of purpose and honest of heart.

    "Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."

  16. Thank you Bradly – the Memory of Mercy make sense. Even tho I have not yet read that chapter, the sections you selected from Paper 28 also partly explains why those in the higher realms waited so long to even round up those who participated in the Lucifer Rebellion. However, the other factor regarding that topic is our human perception & experience of time, which greatly differs from those in the higher realms. The more I read UB & compare it with other books I have read regarding the “afterlife” (including the Bible), I realize that the UB gives far more clarifying details & greater perspectives to the relatively incomplete “glimpses” provided in my other books, though not necessarily making my other books wrong. The UB gives many examples of that when it compares what is in the Bible with what is in the UB. I now better understand why the UB declares that the human perception of reincarnation is technically wrong and is instead a misperception of the “afterlife” Mansion World system, which I think UB also states somewhere. If not stated, it’s implied. Bye for now.

  17. A quick follow-up: Of course I recall the statements in the UB that reveal the origin(s) of the idea of reincarnation, but my last post was referencing that which better explains how/why some people in our world today are able to present more compelling examples of supposed reincarnation cases.  If we fully understood how the Mansion World system works, then those more compelling cases that I have come across would be more easily explained.  As it is, the UB reveals just enough about the Mansion Worlds (& how our minds function) to give us a reasonable overview of the “afterlife” (& our limited/skewed perceptions of that “afterlife”) without revealing all the details. Even some of what the UB does reveal (regarding some topics) is hard to (fully) comprehend, such as how beings from other dimensions must go through one or more “transitions” in order for us to perceive them. By the way, are Caligastia & some of his lower-level associates still here on Urantia yet remain invisible to us humans? If yes, does that mean they could still be causing humanity problems? The UB only mentions that Lucifer and Satan have been arrested, & that Caligastia has only been dethroned. Bye for now.

  18. Hello again. Bradly, some months ago during our online discussion of reincarnation, I believe it was you that asked a very relevant question: What purpose would be served by us being reborn on Earth when the Mansion World system is designed to resolve all of our particular issues? The reason I thought of that recently is because I was reading a book by a famous psychic medium, who gave  specific examples to explain what happens after we die, but I noticed the kinds of examples he gave perfectly fit with what the UB states regarding the Mansion World system.  In one case, a teenager who died said that in the afterlife, he went back to school as his mother had hoped he would have done when he was alive on Earth.  In another example, a man who tragically died “woke up” in the afterlife in a hospital.  One could accuse the psychic of lying, but even IF we assume he was telling the truth, either way it verifies what the UB teaches concerning the Mansion World system, while at the same time, it shows there is NO good reason for a person to be reborn on their native planet. All necessary life lessons can be learned in the afterlife (aka – the “Mansion Worlds”). Bye for now.

  19. Greetings Michael!!

    So glad to hear from you.  All rebels have been detained and isolated effectively as of the completion of Michael’s final bestowal.  Most midwayers, angels, Materials,  and lower celestials and mortal ascenders have been restored and have resolved their loyalty conflicts of the crisis although they remain isolated still.

    The Lanondeks as leaders of the rebellion have not as yet accepted the mercy proferred.  Perhaps they will not ever.  It is true that our one time Planetary Prince remains on Urantia for unspecified reasons and an indeterminate time pending adjudication to come.

    53:9.1 (610.6) Early in the days of the Lucifer rebellion, salvation was offered all rebels by Michael. To all who would show proof of sincere repentance, he offered, upon his attainment of complete universe sovereignty, forgiveness and reinstatement in some form of universe service. None of the leaders accepted this merciful proffer. But thousands of the angels and the lower orders of celestial beings, including hundreds of the Material Sons and Daughters, accepted the mercy proclaimed by the Panoptians and were given rehabilitation at the time of Jesus’ resurrection nineteen hundred years ago. These beings have since been transferred to the Father’s world of Jerusem, where they must be held, technically, until the Uversa courts hand down a decision in the matter of Gabriel vs. Lucifer. But no one doubts that, when the annihilation verdict is issued, these repentant and salvaged personalities will be exempted from the decree of extinction. These probationary souls now labor with the Panoptians in the work of caring for the Father’s world.

    Me here:  I assume Caligastia has powers of mischief making still, to what degree is not specified.  I think rebellious Princes may be interred on-planet in complete isolation as part of a purposeful attempt at rehabilitation but I don’t know.   We are assured Caligastia has been shorn of most powers and his solo nefarious plots are overwhelmed by the celestial hosts of loyal midwayers, angels, Thought Adjusters, etc.

     

    Mortal minds cannot be invaded or directed by ANY other minds or spirits we are assured.

    53:8.9 (610.5) In general, when weak and dissolute mortals are supposed to be under the influence of devils and demons, they are merely being dominated by their own inherent and debased tendencies, being led away by their own natural propensities. The devil has been given a great deal of credit for evil which does not belong to him. Caligastia has been comparatively impotent since the cross of Christ.

    66:8.4 (752.5) The Prince of Urantia went into darkness at the time of the Lucifer rebellion, thus precipitating the long confusion of the planet. He was subsequently deprived of sovereign authority by the co-ordinate action of the constellation rulers and other universe authorities. He shared the inevitable vicissitudes of isolated Urantia down to the time of Adam’s sojourn on the planet and contributed something to the miscarriage of the plan to uplift the mortal races through the infusion of the lifeblood of the new violet race—the descendants of Adam and Eve.

    66:8.5 (753.1) The power of the fallen Prince to disturb human affairs was enormously curtailed by the mortal incarnation of Machiventa Melchizedek in the days of Abraham; and subsequently, during the life of Michael in the flesh, this traitorous Prince was finally shorn of all authority on Urantia.

    66:8.6 (753.2) The doctrine of a personal devil on Urantia, though it had some foundation in the planetary presence of the traitorous and iniquitous Caligastia, was nevertheless wholly fictitious in its teachings that such a “devil” could influence the normal human mind against its free and natural choosing. Even before Michael’s bestowal on Urantia, neither Caligastia nor Daligastia was ever able to oppress mortals or to coerce any normal individual into doing anything against the human will. The free will of man is supreme in moral affairs; even the indwelling Thought Adjuster refuses to compel man to think a single thought or to perform a single act against the choosing of man’s own will.

    66:8.7 (753.3) And now this rebel of the realm, shorn of all power to harm his former subjects, awaits the final adjudication, by the Uversa Ancients of Days, of all who participated in the Lucifer rebellion.

     

    Me here: As to the Mansion Worlds career; we are told that great talents and passions and aspirations with personal meaning and value for us from our birth-life are fully expressed and satisfied there!

    :good:

    "Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."

  20. Thank you Bradly for grouping together the parts of the UB that address my question about Caligastia. I enjoyed reading your entire reply; ironically, your final comment in your post fits well with what I want to share with you & whoever is reading the posts in this forum regarding reincarnation.  I am happy to confirm that UB has specifically addressed a phenomenon often attributed to reincarnation: special human ability (which would certainly include child prodigies). The complete answer can be found in Paper 44, Section 8.  I’m going to condense part of this answer to save time & space in this post… “Celestial artisans do not personally work on material planets, but they sometimes temporarily work under the supervision of the planetary angels of progress.  Supplemental to natural, inherent ability, there may be contributed the leadings of the Thought Adjuster in those individuals whose indwelling Adjusters may have had actual and bona fide experiences along such lines on other worlds and in other mortal creatures. The spirit artisans act as harmonizers to assist and inspire mortals to seek for ever-perfecting ideals and to attempt their enhanced portrayal for the edification of the realm.”  To me, this proves one of my original main points in this forum – that there must be real processes/mechanisms that humans are mis-perceiving as reincarnation for SO many people to believe in such a teaching for thousands of years. I knew there had to be something more to this than modern fantasies or that which caused primitive man to first conceive of reincarnation. No wonder the UB refers to the work of the Thought Adjusters as “cross-planet pollination”, which of course is a comparison to how bees pollinate flowers & other plants. I don’t know the UB will also address other modern claims of reincarnation as specifically as it did special human abilities, but will keep reading the UB to find out.  I value the wealth of knowledge you Bradly (and others) bring to this forum, but seriously consider this useful advice: when trying to find answers in the UB to specific questions or topics, realize that sometimes its best comments are NOT found by a quick online word search. I had no idea the chapter on Celestial Artisans would so clearly address one of my main questions about reincarnation, especially since that word is not used anywhere in Paper 44.  That is not the first time I have realized how the UB provides great information on other subjects within a seemingly unrelated Paper. Bye for now.

Reply on the current forum

↑ Back to top