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"The Book belongs to the era immediately to follow…."

242 posts · 12 participants · started Jan 20, 2015, 5:30 PM

MaraParticipant
Jan 27, 2015, 12:52 AM

emanny3003 wrote:

Mara, what compelled you to start this thread. It is as if it were a tee off for me to say . . . .

I apologize for being too dense to get your tee off.

When I read Carolyn Kendall’s article, I began to ponder the interpretation of what is the era immediately to follow the conclusion of the present ideological struggle. It’s about the Book. It’s about where we are now. I began to ponder what is the present ideological struggle that we have to get past? How will we know, if we can know, when the present ideological struggle has concluded. I thought it was worth thinking about. They tell us, “. . .it is for this better order of affairs on earth that the book has been made ready.”
emanny3003Blocked
Jan 27, 2015, 2:52 AM
No Mara, it was I who was too dense to see. I did not fully realize that this thread was so important. It was revealed to me this afternoon shortly after awaking from a nap.

We are truly on the brink of something wonderful. It is time to celebrate the return of our prodigal brothers. This is the joy of the Father. Yes, there are some who will never return for theirs is the fate of spiritual suicide. Satan has truly made himself unreal. Jesus could not bear to look upon him. But the fatted calf is on the BBQ, for there are those that were lost and are found.

What remains to complete the Father’s joy is to see the eldest son come join the feast and forgive the erring brothers as has Michael and Father. The ego is a mill stone around ones neck. We await Gabriel and those who feel as he does about their brothers that fell into sin to join the party. TUB is a segue to the celebration. It is the bridge to redemption and forgiveness and recovery. And Urantia is host of this celebration. Lets be good hosts. We live on the world of the cross.
emanny3003Blocked
Jan 27, 2015, 10:48 AM
The Urantia Book has a great and powerful purpose. Its purpose is to separate the wheat from the chaff. It is the last great temptation. It is the temptation of knowledge. It is the temptation of the knowledge of good and evil.

The rebellion has been over for nearly two thousand years and yet there are some who would not have it end. TUB provides the next era with the necessary propaganda that will continue to temp persons to take sides. Satan pleaded with Jesus to take sides and Jesus refused, only saying that God’s will be done. Jesus taught to not resist evil. He well knew that Father did not create evil or sin. There is no taking sides between reality and unreality. What Jesus went through we must all go through. That is the necessary segue bridge over to forgiveness.

I will not submit myself to this choosing. I am too quick to take that test. I refuse to be tempted. I refuse to take sides.

The Urantia Book is the temptation of knowledge and the weak would make an idol of it. It would abrogate the Spirit of Truth and the TA and the spirits of the Spirit. It is the crutch of the idolator.

Only three authors of the book have experience with fusion with their TA. The Mighty Messenger is rebellion tested and has chosen sides. The other two are One without Name and Number and One High in Authority, both having much to do with justice in the Superuniverse. They also have chosen sides on the scales of justice.

The Jesus papers were prepared by those without sensitivity to the Spirit of Truth nor did they posses a fragment of the Father. Why was this presentation made to those in possession of both of these Spirits and more? The answer is to propagate propaganda for the case of Gabriel vs Lucifer. It is over Gabriel. Why do you continue to insist that we take sides? Give up your vengeance. Come to the feast table that Michael and Father have prepared.

Truthfully, Gabriel, these children of Father’s that you spit on are immune to your consultations. Father is in us that you would sway to your side.
KerynMember
Jan 27, 2015, 2:18 PM

emanny3003 wrote:

The Urantia Book has a great and powerful purpose. Its purpose is to separate the wheat from the chaff. It is the last great temptation. It is the temptation of knowledge. It is the temptation of the knowledge of good and evil.

Um, whaaaaat? That entire post is just ….. I have no words.
Mark KurtzParticipant
Jan 27, 2015, 2:48 PM
There is a sufficient number of people in the world who do have the ability to think and who honestly attempt to identify truth, see beauty and to judge something as good. And then there could be persons who are resistant, even recalcitrant, who find discomfort in accepting reality. We humans are not omniscient and therefore we could make mistakes. We are all on the river of change, as imperfect beings and this river flows one way with the Father’s plan and Michaels loyalty to him in the larger scheme. Our choice is to go with the river or attempt to swim upstream against the current.

The Urantia Book is here to help humanity; we would do well to attempt a truthful comprehension of its purpose, teachings, and our relationship with the entire Cosmos. We may participate if we choose to do so.

In the meantime we are to love one another.
MaraParticipant
Jan 27, 2015, 4:48 PM
Thank you Bradly, Bonita, Keryn, nelsong, and Mark for your remarks. The book does have a purpose and the book has been given to us in advance of a better order of affairs on earth. “Better” means it’s not better now, but will be when the present confusion is passed.

23:2:12 The confusion and turmoil of Urantia do not signify that the Paradise Rulers lack either interest or ability to manage affairs differently. The Creators are possessed of full power to make Urantia a veritable paradise, but . . . .

4:5:2 One of the greatest sources of confusion on Urantia concerning the nature of God grows out of the failure of your sacred books clearly to distinguish between the personalities of the Paradise Trinity and between Paradise Deity and the local universe creators and administrators. During the past dispensations . . . .

21:5:7 The elevation of a sevenfold bestowal Son to the unquestioned sovereignty of his universe means the beginning of the end of agelong uncertainty and relative confusion. Subsequent to this event . . . .
BonitaParticipant
Jan 27, 2015, 4:55 PM

Bradly wrote:

And yet such a direct criticism of Deity and their control and management of creation and suspicion of motives of the celestial hosts is not to be met by silence either IMO – a form of tacit agreement to my mind.

I agree with you Bradly. The only problem is that speaking up often is seen as a provocation to people with psychic issues, making them angrier and more vocal (crazier). At least they expose themselves that way, but what then? When you’re dealing with illness the approach is sometimes different than dealing with bumptious arrogance. Without doubt we have seen the combination of illness and arrogance on this forum, rather recently . . . now that was a really tough one to deal with, in my opinion. Truth didn’t work, humor didn’t work, facts and logic didn’t work . . . it’s was a conundrum on all fronts.

Anyways, I was thinking of starting a thread on Gabriel, describing his ideal character and his function, but I thought it would be too inflammatory right now. Better to apply the balm of time, I think. But I’m open to suggestions.
MaraParticipant
Jan 27, 2015, 5:13 PM

emanny3003 wrote And Urantia is host of this celebration. Lets be good hosts. We live on the world of the cross.

Yes. Understanding the book is a matter of interpretation isn’t it? And it’s about choice too, isn’t it? There is a difference between viewpoint and insight. Yours is a matter of viewpoint in my opinion – how you reason things out. We are not going to have a uniformity of viewpoint, but there is such a thing as honest differences of points of view.

25:3:7 The moment the Creators bring into existence evolving individuals with the power of choice, that moment a departure is made from the smooth working of divine perfection; misunderstandings are certain to arise, and provision for the fair adjustment of these honest differences of viewpoint must be made. We should all remember that the all-wise and all-powerful Creators could have made the local universes just as perfect as Havona. No conciliating commissions need function in the central universe. But the Creators did not choose in their all-wisdom to do this. And while they have produced universes which abound in differences and teem with difficulties, they have likewise provided the mechanisms and the means for composing all these differences and for harmonizing all this seeming confusion.

Thanks for your interpretation, though it is not popular among our small group.
nelsongParticipant
Jan 27, 2015, 5:50 PM
If there’s interest, maybe later.

____________________________________

Definitely interested Bonita.
BradlyParticipant
Jan 27, 2015, 5:57 PM
Me too!!!

"Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."
nelsongParticipant
Jan 27, 2015, 5:59 PM
Do you think this same sort of ideological struggle goes way back to the fighting described among the early colored races that destroyed Greens and almost destroyed Reds?

Somebody always thinks they are more right than everyone else and if they are given power will use it to prove they are right.

Jesus could have done this during his earth life, become a powerful messiah, nobody could give or take away power from him – he taught us how to deal with this sort of thing.
Brooklyn_bornParticipant
Jan 27, 2015, 6:10 PM

emanny3003 wrote:

The Urantia Book has a great and powerful purpose. Its purpose is to separate the wheat from the chaff. It is the last great temptation. It is the temptation of knowledge. It is the temptation of the knowledge of good and evil. The rebellion has been over for nearly two thousand years and yet there are some who would not have it end. TUB provides the next era with the necessary propaganda that will continue to temp persons to take sides. Satan pleaded with Jesus to take sides and Jesus refused, only saying that God’s will be done. Jesus taught to not resist evil. He well knew that Father did not create evil or sin. There is no taking sides between reality and unreality. What Jesus went through we must all go through. That is the necessary segue bridge over to forgiveness. I will not submit myself to this choosing. I am too quick to take that test. I refuse to be tempted. I refuse to take sides. The Urantia Book is the temptation of knowledge and the weak would make an idol of it. It would abrogate the Spirit of Truth and the TA and the spirits of the Spirit. It is the crutch of the idolator. Only three authors of the book have experience with fusion with their TA. The Mighty Messenger is rebellion tested and has chosen sides. The other two are One without Name and Number and One High in Authority, both having much to do with justice in the Superuniverse. They also have chosen sides on the scales of justice. The Jesus papers were prepared by those without sensitivity to the Spirit of Truth nor did they posses a fragment of the Father. Why was this presentation made to those in possession of both of these Spirits and more? The answer is to propagate propaganda for the case of Gabriel vs Lucifer. It is over Gabriel. Why do you continue to insist that we take sides? Give up your vengeance. Come to the feast table that Michael and Father have prepared. Truthfully, Gabriel, these children of Father’s that you spit on are immune to your consultations. Father is in us that you would sway to your side.

emmany, I speak on behalf certain former participants who ran afoul of those who are in command of this forum. Your recent postings prompted them to contact me. They have positive things to say about the ideas you present here; your recent missives are very well thought out and fairly sensible; lots of caring and love are contained in your messages. These former members appreciate where you are coming from and agree in principle with what you have shared.

BB
emanny3003Blocked
Jan 27, 2015, 6:48 PM
Hi all, While no one here except BB responded to to what I have written, I will do all of you the courtesy to respond directly to what you have written.

Bradly wrote:

While there is much to choose from to refute such notions, unfortunately it resides within the book of propaganda as you claim it to be, a tool of rebellion or authoritarianism it would seem, can’t really tell which from your tirade here.

I wish you had refuted what I wrote line by line but you chose not to. Of have said many times before and will say it again, that TUB is true and factual, and that fact makes it a powerful tool of propaganda. I did not say that it a tool of rebellion or authoritarianisms. Those are your words Bradly, not mine. Why to bear false witness? A tirade is long angry accusation and I am not the least bit angry with anyone.

Bradly wrote:

And that is what disturbs me most and concerns me for your sake Louis, your utter lack of trust, now expressed as paranoia it seems to me.

I do not feel your concern for me Bradly, I feel disdain. You accuse me of utter lack of trust. How can you know this unless I have expressed it to you in some way, and I have not. Paranoia huh? You and Bonita have me diagnosed with mental illness. What gives? Give me something that I have written that appears to be paranoid ideations.

Bradly wrote:

Why then are you here or TB if you believe the UB is but celestial propaganda to falsely accuse and execute an innocent, Lucifer and crew, by the angry and hateful mob in heaven as you claimed at TB?

I did not claim that TUB falsely accused Lucifer or that Lucifer was innocent. I simply said that I am refusing to take sides. I am following the lead of Michael and Father.

Bradly wrote:

How can one claim it is indeed from celestials and then decry its sinister motive at the same time? Illogical in the extreme. T

Again, Bradly, I ask you why you bear false witness against me? I stated that Gabriel has an agenda. That agenda is clearly stated in the phrase, “Gabriel vs Lucifer”. This is not my saying. This is an adversarial relationship and an agenda is always at play. Or is this extremely illogical?

Bradly wrote:

personal perspective that is becoming well entrenched in a fearful and suspicious mind IMO. Hope I’m wrong.

You are wrong, Bradly, because you do not know my mind.

Keryn wrote:

Um, whaaaaat? That entire post is just ….. I have no words.

53:8.4 The Son of Man was confident of success, and he knew that his triumph on your world would forever settle the status of his agelong enemies, not only in Satania but also in the other two systems where sin had entered. There was survival for mortals and security for angels when your Master, in reply to the Lucifer proposals, calmly and with divine assurance replied, “Get you behind me, Satan.” That was, in principle, the real end of the Lucifer rebellion. True, the Uversa tribunals have not yet rendered the executive decision regarding the appeal of Gabriel praying for the destruction of the rebels, but such a decree will, no doubt, be forthcoming in the fullness of time since the first step in the hearing of this case has already been taken.

53:9.4Satan could come to Urantia because you had no Son of standing in residence—neither Planetary Prince nor Material Son. Machiventa Melchizedek has since been proclaimed vicegerent Planetary Prince of Urantia, and the opening of the case of Gabrielvs. Lucifer has signalized the inauguration of temporary planetary regimes on all the isolated worlds. It is true that Satan did periodically visit Caligastia and others of the fallen princes right up to the time of the presentation of these revelations. when there occurred the first hearing of Gabriel’s plea for the annihilation of the archrebels. Satan is now unqualifiedly detained on the Jerusem prison worlds.

Um, whaaaaaaat? Who is Gabriel pleading to? Who is Gabriel praying to?
BradlyParticipant
Jan 27, 2015, 7:07 PM
emanny3003 wrote:

The Urantia Book has a great and powerful purpose. Its purpose is to separate the wheat from the chaff. It is the last great temptation. It is the temptation of knowledge. It is the temptation of the knowledge of good and evil. The rebellion has been over for nearly two thousand years and yet there are some who would not have it end. TUB provides the next era with the necessary propaganda that will continue to temp persons to take sides. Satan pleaded with Jesus to take sides and Jesus refused, only saying that God’s will be done. Jesus taught to not resist evil. He well knew that Father did not create evil or sin. There is no taking sides between reality and unreality. What Jesus went through we must all go through. That is the necessary segue bridge over to forgiveness. I will not submit myself to this choosing. I am too quick to take that test. I refuse to be tempted. I refuse to take sides. The Urantia Book is the temptation of knowledge and the weak would make an idol of it. It would abrogate the Spirit of Truth and the TA and the spirits of the Spirit. It is the crutch of the idolator. Only three authors of the book have experience with fusion with their TA. The Mighty Messenger is rebellion tested and has chosen sides. The other two are One without Name and Number and One High in Authority, both having much to do with justice in the Superuniverse. They also have chosen sides on the scales of justice. The Jesus papers were prepared by those without sensitivity to the Spirit of Truth nor did they posses a fragment of the Father. Why was this presentation made to those in possession of both of these Spirits and more? The answer is to propagate propaganda for the case of Gabriel vs Lucifer. It is over Gabriel. Why do you continue to insist that we take sides? Give up your vengeance. Come to the feast table that Michael and Father have prepared. Truthfully, Gabriel, these children of Father’s that you spit on are immune to your consultations. Father is in us that you would sway to your side.

Sounds paranoid to me….but I’m no psychiatrist.

"Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."
MaraParticipant
Jan 27, 2015, 7:14 PM
Let’s re-direct to the topic. (Bonita wants to open a topic on Gabriel 33:4:0 at another time.)

On page one of the topic Bonita said she thought ideology refers to “. . . economic and political thought, not religion.” But I think religion must be in there too. Jesus was the Word made flesh. The Fifth Epochal is the Word made book. From the Publication Mandate referenced above:

“The future is not open to (your) mortal comprehension, but (you) will do well to diligently study the order, plan, and methods of progression as they were enacted in the earth life of Michael when the Word was made flesh. You are becoming actors in an ensuing episode when the Word is made Book. Great is the difference in these dispensations of religion, but many are the lessons which can be learned from a study of the former age.”

Evolutionary progression certainly includes forward looking political and economic viewpoints. But it seems to me the crux of the matter has to do with whether or not the individuals so engaged are enlightened in their viewpoint with a cosmic outlook.
Brooklyn_bornParticipant
Jan 27, 2015, 7:16 PM

Bradly wrote:

Greetings BB….so there are those who think the UB is celestial propoganda? And its purpose is for us mortals to “take sides” in favor of Gabriel? And the UB is but a “crutch to the idolator”? And Lucifer is unfairly treated? And deserves no justice by his rebellion but is a scapegoat of a vengeful one or mob who should be set free regardless of the demands of mercy and justice as determined by the supreme rulers of the superuniverse and those who reside in Paradise? And the Revelation is an abrogation of both TA and the Spirit of Truth ministries? And that Brother Gabriel “spits” upon us? Really? You know of others who think this of the UB? And this presentation has been “very well thought out and fairly sensible”? And you find these claims and accusations to show “lots of caring and love” rather than suspicion, mistrust, and paranoia toward Deity? Very interesting….and strange to me. Glad such ones are not here if true. While it is not important that any believe the UB is what it claims or that any of its contents contain truth, as each seeker and pilgrim must determine that for themselves, I fail to see the point in such a perspective of outright celestial and Divine treachery and deceit in the UB. Would it not be more appropriate then to throw it aside? Or honestly debunk its origin and contents? Why use the text itself to try and prove your point if you are convinced its a pack of lies intended to deceive us? Which way is it? All rhetorical questions BB….I’m not asking you to represent or defend any others’ points of view.

Bradly, at the end of the day, every individual reader has an OPINION on what the UB conveys. We will agree on some things, we will disagree on others. Such is the fact of life, my friend.

BB
emanny3003Blocked
Jan 27, 2015, 7:19 PM

Mark Kurtz wrote:

There is a sufficient number of people in the world who do have the ability to think and who honestly attempt to identify truth, see beauty and to judge something as good. And then there could be persons who are resistant, even recalcitrant, who find discomfort in accepting reality.

Wow Mark, who are these brothers who cannot think? Did the ministries pass them by? Are you accusing God of playing favorites with his children? So, since you are on a roll with your judgements, Mark, which one am I?

Mark Kurtz wrote:

The Urantia Book is here to help humanity; we would do well to attempt a truthful comprehension of its purpose, teachings, and our relationship with the entire Cosmos. We may participate if we choose to do so.

So does TUB usurp the Spirit of Truth and the TAs and the spirits of the Spirit? We would do well to attempt a truthful communication with these spirits, and our relationship with the entire cosmos. We may participate if we choose to do so.

Except that TUB requires a graduate level reading comprehension and the Spirits do not. Even the Alpheus twins can participate.

Bonita wrote:

Loving others includes getting them psychic help when they need it. We’ve seen more than our fair share of unstable psyches on these forums.

Perhaps you can start a fund for psychiatric help, a crisis intervention, for me. Or at least pay for my Haldol.

Bonita wrote:

Reading the UB with the material mind creates enormous distortion.

Perhaps a warning label for TUB potential reader is needed for those not at your level of thinking, Bonita.

Bonita wrote:

The fact that it can be so easily identified is actually a sign of group progress.

But no facts have been presented. You nor anyone else have identified anything I have written.

Bonita wrote:

I agree with you Bradly. The only problem is that speaking up often is seen as a provocation to people with psychic issues, making them angrier and more vocal (crazier).

Since when have you not agreed with Bradly, Bonita? I do not feel provoked, I feel ignored. None of you save BB have quoted my “crazy” words.

Bonita wrote:

Without doubt we have seen the combination of illness and arrogance on this forum, rather recently . . . now that was a really tough one to deal with, in my opinion. Truth didn’t work, humor didn’t work, facts and logic didn’t work . . . it’s was a conundrum on all fronts.

So I am arrogant, mentally ill, and really tough to deal with. That is a conundrum. What shall we do with this man? Perhaps nail him to a tree?

Mara wrote:

Yes. Understanding the book is a matter of interpretation isn’t it? And it’s about choice too, isn’t it? There is a difference between viewpoint and insight. Yours is a matter of viewpoint in my opinion – how you reason things out. We are not going to have a uniformity of viewpoint, but there is such a thing as honest differences of points of view.

Thank you for that Mara. You have my respect.

Mara wrote:

Thanks for your interpretation, though it is not popular among our small group.

Not popular but perhaps blasphemous.

Brooklyn_born wrote:

emmany, I speak on behalf certain former participants who ran afoul of those who are in command of this forum. Your recent postings prompted them to contact me. They have positive things to say about the ideas you present here; your recent missives are very well thought out and fairly sensible; lots of caring and love are contained in your messages. These former members appreciate where you are coming from and agree in principle with what you have shared.

Thank you, BB.
emanny3003Blocked
Jan 27, 2015, 7:57 PM

Bradly wrote:

emanny3003 wrote:
The Urantia Book has a great and powerful purpose. Its purpose is to separate the wheat from the chaff. It is the last great temptation. It is the temptation of knowledge. It is the temptation of the knowledge of good and evil. The rebellion has been over for nearly two thousand years and yet there are some who would not have it end. TUB provides the next era with the necessary propaganda that will continue to temp persons to take sides. Satan pleaded with Jesus to take sides and Jesus refused, only saying that God’s will be done. Jesus taught to not resist evil. He well knew that Father did not create evil or sin. There is no taking sides between reality and unreality. What Jesus went through we must all go through. That is the necessary segue bridge over to forgiveness. I will not submit myself to this choosing. I am too quick to take that test. I refuse to be tempted. I refuse to take sides. The Urantia Book is the temptation of knowledge and the weak would make an idol of it. It would abrogate the Spirit of Truth and the TA and the spirits of the Spirit. It is the crutch of the idolator. Only three authors of the book have experience with fusion with their TA. The Mighty Messenger is rebellion tested and has chosen sides. The other two are One without Name and Number and One High in Authority, both having much to do with justice in the Superuniverse. They also have chosen sides on the scales of justice. The Jesus papers were prepared by those without sensitivity to the Spirit of Truth nor did they posses a fragment of the Father. Why was this presentation made to those in possession of both of these Spirits and more? The answer is to propagate propaganda for the case of Gabriel vs Lucifer. It is over Gabriel. Why do you continue to insist that we take sides? Give up your vengeance. Come to the feast table that Michael and Father have prepared. Truthfully, Gabriel, these children of Father’s that you spit on are immune to your consultations. Father is in us that you would sway to your side.

Sounds paranoid to me….but I’m no psychiatrist.

Refute it all Bradly, line by line.

You seem suspicious of what I write. You seem to bear a grudge towards me and interpret my words as hostile. You always self reference yourself. You have a tenacious sense of personal right. You are an eager observer of TUB and quote it often to validate your biases. You feel that my words are dangerous and have said so in TB. You do not appreciate the evidence I present. You are always guarded with your writing with saying such as “in my opinion”, “but I am no psychiatrist”, and “I hope I am wrong”. You are hypersensitive and feel easily slighted.

Sounds paranoid to me… Look up “Paranoid personality disorder” ICD-10 F60.0. Perhaps Bonita can help you. Although her patients were mostly unconscious. Not so tough to deal with.
BonitaParticipant
Jan 27, 2015, 8:47 PM

Mara wrote:

Evolutionary progression certainly includes forward looking political and economic viewpoints. But it seems to me the crux of the matter has to do with whether or not the individuals so engaged are enlightened in their viewpoint with a cosmic outlook.

I agree. I think you’ve more or less restated these quotes:

111:4.3 The advances of true civilization are all born in this inner world of mankind. It is only the inner life that is truly creative.

111:4.5 Only in the higher levels of the superconscious mind as it impinges upon the spirit realm of human experience can you find those higher concepts in association with effective master patterns which will contribute to the building of a better and more enduring civilization. Personality is inherently creative, but it thus functions only in the inner life of the individual.

My point was that the definition of the word ideology is as follows:

ideology |ˌīdēˈäləjē, ˌidē-|noun1 ( pl. ideologies ) a system of ideas and ideals, esp. one that forms the basis of economic or political theory and policy

I think when they speak of ideological struggles, they are speaking about the economic and political theories that influence civilization as a whole. Religion is personal and involves the individual which then affects the whole, but that would be an individual struggle. They were talking about epochal struggles, or so I think.
BonitaParticipant
Jan 27, 2015, 8:50 PM

nelsong wrote: Definitely interested Bonita.

Bradly wrote: Me too!!!

Alright, you two. I will start a thread if you both promise me to post on it. Deal?

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