The Bright and Morning Star

158 posts · 10 participants · started Jan 28, 2015, 1:46 PM

1. B

   BradlyParticipant
   Feb 5, 2015, 2:10 PM

    

   Most bitterly did he (Lucifer) attack the right of the Ancients of Days—”foreign potentates”—to interfere in the affairs of the local systems and universes. These rulers he denounced as tyrants and usurpers. He exhorted his followers to believe that none of these rulers could do aught to interfere with the operation of complete home rule if men and angels only had the courage to assert themselves and boldly claim their rights. (53:3.1)

   Or – most resentfully and ruefully did he aggressively blame and accuse……?

   Not getting the connection here of the claim that the low and fear based human emotions are common to celestials….that is the claim, yes?

   Apologies Bonita but it seems every active topic has been  most bitterly attacked.  We are under assault in another war of ideas that now has taken this entire site hostage…quite literally.  Sad indeed.

   "Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."

2. B

   BonitaParticipant
   Feb 5, 2015, 2:15 PM

   Bradly wrote:

   Me here:  rather than metaphor, perhaps it is only a matter of WHICH optional definition is applied to a word that is used?  The “war” was a 7 year “discussion” and debate about realities and loyalties in which all participants moved freely between opposing presentations, yes?

   Yes, it was a war of wills.  Self-will butting it’s ugly, putrid horned head against God’s will, against the God who is LOVE.  Yes, a bitter conflict between unmitigated selfishness and the absolute perfect ideal of selflessness. (Incidentally represented by Gabriel, the person this thread is about.)

3. B

   BonitaParticipant
   Feb 5, 2015, 2:22 PM

   Bradly wrote:

   Apologies Bonita but it seems every active topic has been  most bitterly attacked.  We are under assault in another war of ideas that now has taken this entire site hostage…quite literally.  Sad indeed.

   Yes.  I adamantly implore that group justice rein in the chaos created by the hostage takers.  I don’t believe it is a sound practice to negotiate with brutish, guerilla-like terrorists and bullcrap bombers.

   Thanks so much for your wisdom Bradly. I truly enjoy your input and your scholarship.  It’s like fresh air . . .  oops, another metaphor.

4. E

   emanny3003Blocked
   Feb 5, 2015, 3:17 PM

   The war in heaven was deadlier than anything on earth. To the victor goes the annihilation of the vanquished. Not even an atomic bomb could accomplish that.

   Bradly wrote:

   Or – most resentfully and ruefully did he aggressively blame and accuse……?

   Yes, I’ll accept that definition.

   Bradly wrote:

   Not getting the connection here of the claim that the low and fear based human emotions are common to celestials….that is the claim, yes?

   You are terrified of backing the wrong horse because you have gambled. I am NOT a gambler.

   Bonita wrote:

   Thanks so much for your wisdom Bradly. I truly enjoy your input and your scholarship.  It’s like fresh air . . .  oops, another metaphor.

   Is your wisdom perfect, Bradly? If so, you are then the superior of the Melchizedeks who’s wisdom is not perfect.

   Perhaps those prone to metaphor are metaphors themselves. Oops, or perhaps just a Freudian slip?

5. B

   BonitaParticipant
   Feb 5, 2015, 3:46 PM

   The universe administration, as concerns Gabriel, is unchanged from the times prior to rebellion.  Stability is part of the administration of our universe and not even renegade promulgated chaos was able to unseat it. Truth, beauty and goodness always win out in any conflict.  Our universe, under the glorious executive administration of our Bright and Morning Star, Gabriel, continues to move toward light and life despite all the distractions designed to destroy it.

6. B

   BradlyParticipant
   Feb 5, 2015, 4:49 PM
   emanny3003 wrote:

   Is your wisdom perfect, Bradly? If so, you are then the superior of the Melchizedeks who’s wisdom is not perfect.

    

   To be mocked by some is but a compliment to the target.  A dull and rather stupid question…must be rhetorical.  Nontheless:

   As to my “wisdom”…..hmmmmm…..on a scale of 1 to 10 and based on the wisdom witnessed by me in others, I’ll claim a 3 I think on the mortal scale (due more to age and experience than any profound understanding or lack of confusion).  On the celestial scale?    Hahahaha…..not on the radar yet let alone that scale.

   

   "Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."

7. B

   BonitaParticipant
   Feb 5, 2015, 5:25 PM

   Bradly wrote:

   As to my “wisdom”…..hmmmmm…..on a scale of 1 to 10 and based on the wisdom witnessed by me in others, I’ll claim a 3 I think on the mortal scale (due more to age and experience than any profound understanding or lack of confusion).  On the celestial scale?    Hahahaha…..not on the radar yet let alone that scale.

   Well said Brad.  But I think you are wiser than you think.  One thing we know with certainty, our Bright and Morning Star is wiser than all of us put together, including the great transgressor.

8. M

   MaraParticipant
   Feb 5, 2015, 6:30 PM

   Gabriel is the chief executive and actual administrator of Nebadon. An administrator is one who is in a position of authority who manages persons, practices and policies – someone who ensures the day-to-day running of something – someone who is running the show – a person performing official duties in some sphere – in our case the universe of Nebadon, a universe of 100 constellations. Each constellation is comprised of 100 Systems (actual and/or projected) of which our system, Satania, is one of 10,000 systems in our constellation – Norlatiadek.  At the last registry there were 3,840,101 inhabited planets in Nebadon. 32:2:9

    

   33:0:1   WHILE the Universal Father most certainly rules over his vast creation, he functions in a local universe administration through the person of the Creator Son. The Father does not otherwise personally function in the administrative affairs of a local universe. These matters are intrusted to the Creator Son and to the local universe Mother Spirit and to their manifold children. The plans, policies, and administrative acts of the local universe are formed and executed by this Son, who, in conjunction with his Spirit associate, delegates executive power to Gabriel and jurisdictional authority to the Constellation Fathers, System Sovereigns, and Planetary Princes.

   Gabriel presides over the armies of heaven as supreme commander.  The intelligence corps range the local universe, gathering information of the realms for Gabriel’s guidance in the councils of Nebadon.

   39:2:3   1. The Intelligence Corps. These seraphim [superior seraphim] belong to the personal staff of Gabriel, the Bright and Morning Star. They range the local universe gathering the information of the realms for his guidance in the councils of Nebadon. They are the intelligence corps of the mighty hosts over which Gabriel presides as vicegerent of the Master Son. These seraphim are not directly affiliated with either the systems or the constellations, and their information pours in direct to Salvington upon a continuous, direct, and independent circuit.

   And the entire judicial mechanism of Nebadon is under the supervision of Gabriel.  33:7:2  The universe headquarters worlds are concerned largely with adjudication 33:8:1  and some cases are sent up to the higher courts of our superuniverse..
9. B

   BonitaParticipant
   Feb 5, 2015, 6:50 PM

   Mara wrote:

   Gabriel is the chief executive and actual administrator of Nebadon. An administrator is one who is in a position of authority who manages persons, practices and policies – someone who ensures the day-to-day running of something – someone who is running the show – a person performing official duties in some sphere – in our case the universe of Nebadon, a universe of 100 constellations. Each constellation is comprised of 100 Systems (actual and/or projected) of which our system, Satania, is one of 10,000 systems in our constellation – Norlatiadek.  At the last registry there were 3,840,101 inhabited planets in Nebadon. 32:2:9

   Think about that for a minute.  Imagine!  Gabriel is chief executive of a universe with almost 4 million planets.  That’s 4 million Planetary Princes to deal with.  How many of those Princes give him a daily headache? Less than a handful, from what we’re told.  The rest seem quite satisfied with his leadership.  Hmmm. Sounds like he’s obviously very successful and well loved by an enormous number of beings.

   Why is it that the noisy and obnoxious always try to single themselves out?  They are a minority but make such a huge amount of fuss.  They seem to love chaos instead of order and stability. Maybe they’re bored with stability.  Maybe boredom could be cured by forgetting about oneself and offering some service.  We are told that boredom and monotony are symptoms of immaturity.  At least Gabriel is mature enough to appreciate working towards universe stability – a.k.a. light and life.

10. M

    MaraParticipant
    Feb 5, 2015, 7:30 PM

    Bonita wrote: Why is it that the noisy and obnoxious . . . .

    Who knows?  It’s speculative.  Only God knows ones true motives.  We get a picture only of the outward – the outside of someone’s word-expressions.  The use of provocative language seems to say “please notice me”.  The penchant to harp on one’s point to view, the perseveration of it here and on other threads, is irksome to me.  But, we’re to try to find out his reasons for such objectionable conduct.

     100:4:4 If someone irritates you, causes feelings of resentment, you should sympathetically seek to discern his viewpoint, his reasons for such objectionable conduct. If once you understand your neighbor, you will become tolerant, and this tolerance will grow into friendship and ripen into love.

    Nevertheless,  whether I understand someone’s conduct or not, I’m going to continue studying the Book with you.
11. B

    BonitaParticipant
    Feb 5, 2015, 8:06 PM

    Mara wrote:  Nevertheless, whether I understand someone’s conduct or not, I’m going to continue studying the Book with you.

    I admire your desire to understand it.  And I agree that it seems like a cry for help . . . just not sure we have the necessary medicine here.  Some level of tolerance will have to suffice, but understanding . . . not so much.

    I likewise will continue to study the Book with you.  It’s good to have another woman to work with and I appreciate it very much.

12. M

    MaraParticipant
    Feb 5, 2015, 9:16 PM

    Bonita wrote: Gabriel is chief executive of a universe with almost 4 million planets.

    And, the thoughts and acts of Gabriel will ever be fully representative of both the Creator Son and the Creative Spirit.  Such a being is also capable of a broad understanding of, and sympathetic contact with, both the spiritual seraphic hosts and the material evolutionary will creatures.

    33:4:3   This first-born of the parents of a new universe is a unique personality possessing many wonderful traits not visibly present in either ancestor, a being of unprecedented versatility and unimagined brilliance. This supernal personality embraces the divine will of the Son combined with the creative imagination of the Spirit. The thoughts and acts of the Bright and Morning Star will ever be fully representative of both the Creator Son and the Creative Spirit. Such a being is also capable of a broad understanding of, and sympathetic contact with, both the spiritual seraphic hosts and the material evolutionary will creatures.

    Our Creator Son and our Creative Spirit have Gabriel in their presence to confer with on important universe procedures, excluding creation and life impartation.

    33:4:4 [#2]

    The Bright and Morning Star is not a creator, but he is a marvelous administrator, being the personal administrative representative of the Creator Son. Aside from creation and life impartation the Son and the Spirit never confer upon important universe procedures without Gabriel’s presence.

13. B

    BonitaParticipant
    Feb 6, 2015, 3:06 PM

    Mara wrote:  Our Creator Son and our Creative Spirit have Gabriel in their presence to confer with on important universe procedures, excluding creation and life impartation.

    Yes, I brought this up on page two when a big stink was raised about the fact that Gabriel is considerably limited in the attributes of deity. (33:4.2)  The only attributes he is considerably limited in are creation and life impartation.  Both of those deity attributes are retained by his parents (not delegated).  That is their prerogative. They created the Bright and Morning Star to be an administrator, not a creator or life giver.

    This is what I said on page 2:

    The Bright and Morning Star is the ideal of divinity. He is the highest personality in the local universe after his parents. His divinity is equal to both the Creative Son and Spirit; his thoughts and actions will ever be fully representative of both of his parents. The only deity attributes not imparted to him by his creator parents are their creator and life impartation prerogatives (33:4.4); otherwise, he partakes of their attributes fully, and in addition, has some of his own due to his combined parentage.

14. M

    MaraParticipant
    Feb 6, 2015, 3:24 PM

    Did you post this? 

    When a Michael Son is absent from his universe, its government is directed by the first-born native being, the Bright and Morning Star, the local universe chief executive.  21:2:11

15. B

    BonitaParticipant
    Feb 6, 2015, 3:41 PM

    Mara wrote:  Did you post this?

    Only indirectly.  I try not to go overboard with posting direct quotes because it makes some people crazy (or crazier). I referred to Gabriel’s direction of universe affairs when Michael was absent in the quote below.  It seems he never attempts to administrate completely alone. That’s wise, I think.

    Bonita wrote:  Even though Gabriel is the chief executive of Nebadon and even though he was created fully endowed for this work, when Michael was on his bestowals, Gabriel did not direct universe affairs alone.  He was always in collaboration with the Union of Days.  Even when acting as regent in Michael’s absence, he seeks counsel from Immanuel of Salvington. Gabriel’s executive role is not one of a dictator or autocrat.

16. M

    MaraParticipant
    Feb 6, 2015, 3:51 PM

    Bonita wrote:  It seems he never attempts to administrate completely alone.

    I was surprised to discover in my research on Gabriel that Nebadon headquarters worlds are largely concerned with adjudication.  And justice-judgment is administered by teams, not by a lone individual.

    33:8:1   On Salvington, the headquarters of Nebadon, there are no true legislative bodies. The universe headquarters worlds are concerned largely with adjudication. The legislative assemblies of the local universe are located on the headquarters of the one hundred constellations. The systems are chiefly concerned with the executive and administrative work of the local creations. The System Sovereigns and their associates enforce the legislative mandates of the constellation rulers and execute the judicial decrees of the high courts of the universe.

17. M

    MaraParticipant
    Feb 6, 2015, 3:57 PM

    I meant to post this reference in regard to adjudication by teamwork:

    33:7:2   The entire judicial mechanism of Nebadon is under the supervision of Gabriel. The high courts, located on Salvington, are occupied with problems of general universe import and with the appellate cases coming up from the system tribunals. There are seventy branches of these universe courts, and they function in seven divisions of ten sections each. In all matters of adjudication there presides a dual magistracy consisting of one judge of perfection antecedents and one magistrate of ascendant experience.

18. B

    BonitaParticipant
    Feb 7, 2015, 4:03 PM

    Apparently, once Nebadon is settled in light and life there are readjustments in the administration.  Then Gabriel will have direct contact with the Ancients of Days while Michael is away from Salvington.  He only has indirect contact now.

    55:10.4 The settling of an entire local universe in light and life inaugurates profound readjustments in the entire scheme of administration, from the individual inhabited worlds to the universe headquarters. New relationships extend down to the constellations and systems. The local universe Mother Spirit experiences new liaison relations with the Master Spirit of the superuniverse, and Gabriel establishes direct contact with the Ancients of Days to be effective when and as the Master Son may be absent from the headquarters world.

     

19. N

    nelsongParticipant
    Feb 8, 2015, 8:57 PM

    Flash

    gabriel lives in Sedona az

     

    john the baptist too

    im livin in the wrong place

20. B

    BonitaParticipant
    Feb 8, 2015, 9:24 PM

    Gabriel appeared to Adam and Eve to pronounce their judgment, but he was not the one judging them.  The judgment had come from Salvington.

    75:7.1 It was while the Edenic caravan was halted that Adam and Eve were informed of the nature of their transgressions and advised concerning their fate. Gabriel appeared to pronounce judgment. And this was the verdict: The Planetary Adam and Eve of Urantia are adjudged in default; they have violated the covenant of their trusteeship as the rulers of this inhabited world.

    75:7.2 While downcast by the sense of guilt, Adam and Eve were greatly cheered by the announcement that their judges on Salvington had absolved them from all charges of standing in “contempt of the universe government.” They had not been held guilty of rebellion.

     

     

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