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"Resume their lives just where they left off when overtaken by death"

254 posts · 11 participants · started Aug 19, 2017, 7:09 PM

  1. So let me see if I understand you correctly, Midi. The history of Lucifer of Cagliari is a reflection or parallels the celestial history of Lucifer of Satania; “the as above so below,” axiom, if you will. Correct?

    In order to answer your question, it would be necessary to present a better understanding of time, and its active components, where for many time is linear, in that from the present, the future is to be, and from the present the past was, or is.  The human or material thinking of time would include a paradox effect, if one thinks about “the grandfather paradox”, where if one were to travel back in time, and their grandfather were removed from existence prior to procreating offspring, they would no longer exist, simultaneously changing the present from which that traveler came.  However, when one thinks of eternity in a temporal sense it cannot be associated to a linear sequence, and is more so like all possible potential sequences, where the only reality is the present which is dependent on the future, what will be, or is.  One cannot really know what will be unless they look at what was in the past, and if what was seems to have changed from what they remember in the present, it would validate that a paradox has occurred.  In the UB it infers that the Ancient of Days, perform the final verdict of any judgment imposed, because they know what should be, or as close to what should be in order to get to what will be or is.  One might think of this, not as a parallel or reflection of the past because free will in the present can be considered as chaotic unless, as indicated in the UB, one follows or does the will of the Father, where this can be associated with a more orderly cause and effect, and when followed becomes perfection.  When one ventures off the path of doing the Father’s will, other adjustments would be necessary, in order to get back on the perfect path, which in essence, this constant motion seems to produce the affect that we associate with time.

    So, as we look at history, and find new history that may assimilate the “as above, so below” axiom, we may also find a better understanding of what is “above” and is “below”, where both change, in order to fill in that which has been lost through material creation, and held only in spirit.

     

  2. Hi Midi – regarding “this unseen Father” (603.4, 53:3.3), the Father was “unseen” only in Lucifer’s experience. Recall that, as a Lanonandek, Lucifer was one of Michael’s youngest and most fragile babies. A real problem faced by such precocious Lanonandeks (“the Lanonandek dilemma”) is that their minds are tuned to perform as administrators in the context of a local system. Not having any experience of the transcendental domains of the central universe, let alone Paradise, Lucifer — like all his fellow Local Universe Sons — had to take the truth-fact of the Paradise Father… on faith.

    “Nigel Nunn”, you wrote above and put in quotation (“the Lanonandek dilemma”), where I don’t know where you sited this from.  However, you state that Lucifer was one of the “youngest and most fragile”, also the following UB narration would indicate that he might have been one of the oldest?

    (601.1) 53:0.1 LUCIFER was a brilliant primary Lanonandek Son of Nebadon. He had experienced service in many systems, had been a high counselor of his group, and was distinguished for wisdom, sagacity, and efficiency. Lucifer was number 37 of his order, and when commissioned by the Melchizedeks, he was designated as one of the one hundred most able and brilliant personalities in more than seven hundred thousand of his kind. From such a magnificent beginning, through evil and error, he embraced sin and now is numbered as one of three System Sovereigns in Nebadon who have succumbed to the urge of self and surrendered to the sophistry of spurious personal liberty — rejection of universe allegiance and disregard of fraternal obligations, blindness to cosmic relationships.

    It would also indicate that his “sin” was to go against his oath, which would have been a requirement, for office, where upon his realization of additional information, he may have found it difficult to follow the mandates of the Most Highs?  This would have been similar to the default of Adam and Eve, where their actions in them selves did not default them but that they went against the required oath, that they made to not go against the mandates imposed by the Most Highs.  The universal Father did not mandate those laws held within the oath, but the constellation law makes who made up these laws, as they saw fit. Or, at least that’s how I read it in the UB.

    So, would you take an oath, that may go against the bestowal of free will given by the Universal Father to all His creatures?  Which also would mean that you also give up your own free will as well.

  3. Hi Midi — have you forgotten the origin and nature of Lanonandeks?

    Recall that they were the last of the local universe sons to be created by Michael and the Divine Mins. Given their relatively low level of creation (compared to their elder brothers, the Vorondadeks and Melchizedeks), and their variability in capacity, Lanonandeks were Michael’s only local universe children that needed to be evaluated and sorted before being assigned an appropriate career. The brightest (Primary Lanonandeks, 35:8.4) would go on to become System Sovereigns; the least bright (Tertiary Lanonandeks, 35:8.6) would serve as “assistants, messengers, custodians, …“.

    To help set the scene, here are the first two paragraphs describing their origin and nature. (from Paper 35 section 8):

    8. The Lanonandek Sons

    (392.1) 35:8.1 After the creation of the Vorondadeks, the Creator Son and the Universe Mother Spirit unite for the purpose of bringing into existence the third order of universe sonship, the Lanonandeks. Although occupied with varied tasks connected with the system administrations, they are best known as System Sovereigns, the rulers of the local systems, and as Planetary Princes, the administrative heads of the inhabited worlds.

    (392.2) 35:8.2 Being a later and lower — as concerns divinity levels — order of sonship creation, these beings were required to pass through certain courses of training on the Melchizedek worlds in preparation for subsequent service. They were the first students in the Melchizedek University and were classified and certified by their Melchizedek teachers and examiners according to ability, personality, and attainment.

    Regarding the “the Lanonandek dilemma”, given your eidetic memory, I thought you’d recall my short paper of the same name. Please see the attached filie, LanonandekDilemma.pdf.

    Regarding the issue of Lanonandeks in Nebadon, I’m sure you recall 35:9.8:

    (393.8) 35:9.8 “[snip] On Uversa it is the consensus that we have had so much administrative trouble in Nebadon because our Sons of the Lanonandek order have been created with such a large degree of personal liberty in choosing and planning.”

    Midi — please pause to consider the many BILLIONS of years Michael and his family of (local universe) sons and daughters spent as AS A FAMILY in Nebadon, before attempting “the phenomenon on man”. You may not yet realize the point of creating Nebadon?

    (359.5, 32:2.8) “And then, when such a universe has been so completely organized and so repletely manned, does the Creator Son enter into the Father’s proposal to create mortal man in their divine image.”

    Nigel

    Attachments:
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  4. Here’s another way to look at deficits. Just for illustration, imagine the soul is a piece of fabric that is supposed to have every flower in the world woven into it in order to be complete. If a person dies with a piece of fabric with only a few dozen flowers on it, that person has a deficit. There are many reason why that can happen: a life too short, a life where not every flower was available, an inability to weave, or slowness of weaving, preoccupation with shiny objects, a dislike of flowers or weaving . . . there are zillions of reasons why that fabric arrived in the next life without all the flowers on it, but as long as some effort was put into weaving, then more time and more opportunities are given. Another way to look at deficits is comparing the soul to a plant. Some folks arrive on the mansion worlds with a full grown tree heavy with fruit. Some folks arrive with a tree and not so much fruit. Others arrive with a bush and some with a seedling. Surely the seedling is at a deficit, it needs more help than the full grown fruit-bearing tree, and it will get all the help it needs on the appropriate mansion world. Trying to think of other ways to illustrate deficit, but I have a deficit of things done . . . gotta long to-do list this weekend.

    Lovely and useful parables Bonita, good metaphors for pointing out that it is absent or malformed character traits that make up the ‘mark of the beast,’ erroneous attitudes and negative ways of being. Impatience, ease-seeking, pride, selfishness, these are some of things that must be worked on and worked out of the mortal ascender. They are simply leftover animal tendencies that eventually burn up in the purifying fires of morontia life. We start out with DNA based character on Earth and evolve it to spirit based values of eternal sublimity On High, over time and thru experience, according to the authors. And I find it true, during life one animal trait after another falls away. Like chips from an emerging sculpture (Adjuster as hammer, personal will as chisel), once removed the real self emerges as one entity, beautiful and divine. Even perfect, after much polishing.

    .

    Richard E Warren

  5. Free will:

    https://urassoc.arko.nyc/search/?zoom_sort=2&zoom_query=%22free+will%22&zoom_per_page=10&zoom_and=0&zoom_cat%5B%5D=-1

    True Liberty:

    https://urassoc.arko.nyc/search/?zoom_sort=2&zoom_query=%22true+liberty%22&zoom_per_page=10&zoom_and=0&zoom_cat%5B%5D=-1

    False Liberty:

    https://urassoc.arko.nyc/search/?zoom_sort=2&zoom_query=%22false+liberty%22&zoom_per_page=10&zoom_and=0&zoom_cat%5B%5D=-1

    God the Supreme:

    https://urassoc.arko.nyc/search/?zoom_sort=2&zoom_query=%22god+the+supreme%22&zoom_per_page=10&zoom_and=0&zoom_cat%5B%5D=-1

     

    ;-)

     

    "Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."

  6. So far, by your many recent posts and topics here, you have failed completely to offer us a single contradiction, merely illustrated your lust for this quest and demonstrating a personal lack of comprehension.

    In doing some research after Nigel’s reply, I found what might be considered as a contradiction in the text of the UB, however as it has been noted, with God all things are possible?  So, Bradly if you would examine the following UB quote, and compare it with others found in Book Four, as presented below.

    (385.1) 35:1.2 In the universe of Nebadon the Father Melchizedek acts as the first executive associate of the Bright and Morning Star. Gabriel is occupied more with universe policies, Melchizedek with practical procedures. Gabriel presides over the regularly constituted tribunals and councils of Nebadon, Melchizedek over the special, extraordinary, and emergency commissions and advisory bodies. Gabriel and the Father Melchizedek are never away from Salvington at the same time, for in Gabriel’s absence the Father Melchizedek functions as the chief executive of Nebadon.

    As noted above, “Gabriel and the Father Melchizedek are never away from Salvington at the same time”.  However, in the follwong UB quotes, it indicates that they were both in the presences of Jesus, on Urantia, where if the previous quote, if true and a fact, then the following contradicts that posted above?

    (1753.2) 158:1.6 It was about three o’clock on this beautiful afternoon that Jesus took leave of the three apostles, saying: “I go apart by myself for a season to commune with the Father and his messengers; I bid you tarry here and, while awaiting my return, pray that the Father’s will may be done in all your experience in connection with the further bestowal mission of the Son of Man.” And after saying this to them, Jesus withdrew for a long conference with Gabriel and the Father Melchizedek, not returning until about six o’clock. When Jesus saw their anxiety over his prolonged absence, he said: “Why were you afraid? You well know I must be about my Father’s business; wherefore do you doubt when I am not with you? I now declare that the Son of Man has chosen to go through his full life in your midst and as one of you. Be of good cheer; I will not leave you until my work is finished.”

    (1753.3) 158:1.7 As they partook of their meager evening meal, Peter asked the Master, “How long do we remain on this mountain away from our brethren?” And Jesus answered: “Until you shall see the glory of the Son of Man and know that whatsoever I have declared to you is true.” And they talked over the affairs of the Lucifer rebellion while seated about the glowing embers of their fire until darkness drew on and the apostles’ eyes grew heavy, for they had begun their journey very early that morning.

    (1753.4) 158:1.8 When the three had been fast asleep for about half an hour, they were suddenly awakened by a near-by crackling sound, and much to their amazement and consternation, on looking about them, they beheld Jesus in intimate converse with two brilliant beings clothed in the habiliments of the light of the celestial world. And Jesus’ face and form shone with the luminosity of a heavenly light. These three conversed in a strange language, but from certain things said, Peter erroneously conjectured that the beings with Jesus were Moses and Elijah; in reality, they were Gabriel and the Father Melchizedek. The physical controllers had arranged for the apostles to witness this scene because of Jesus’ request.

    I’m sure Bradly, with your extensive knowledge of what the UB says and does not say, that you can present an explanation that indicate that these quotes do not contradict each other?

    I can think of one answer where this would not be a contradiction but in its explanation, would create another contradiction, so either way, a possible contradiction.  No – ???

  7. Hope to hear from others….but my presumption is “reflectivity” which would not be a “contradiction” at all:

     

    https://urassoc.arko.nyc/search/?zoom_sort=2&zoom_query=reflectivity&zoom_per_page=50&zoom_and=0&zoom_cat%5B%5D=-1

    How to ‘appear’ to be in more than one place at the same time!!  Note the TA’s capabilities in this regard…was John actually at the scene he witnessed regarding his revelation?   Nope.  Ever heard of or studied this most practical of functionalities in time and space?

    ;-)

    "Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."

  8. Whoa! Is that true? If it is, it’s remarkably evil. The worst I’ve seen in the TUB community, ever! It’s nauseating, isn’t it? Definitely not utilizing those two highest adjutants at all, let alone the soul. Whew . . . what a mess! That’s what I’m talking about . . . if you allow the adjutants to do their ministry, none of this would happen. . . . Dang! that’s awful . . . yuck . . . can’t get that bad taste out of my mouth.

    Well Bonita, it might have been if it were not for the person using the avatar name “fanofVan”, who seemed to feed the flames and added to the subject matter. Why, when the implication came around that “Van” might have feed the flames of the rebellion, and as indicated in the text that “Van” had little regard for his fellows, causing a distraction so that the Tree of Life could be stolen by “Van’s” followers, and putting all those, the majority of his fellows, to suffer the aspects of death, the flames got even higher. All in all, that subject would have made for a very good thesis paper, on the general behavior of persons, especially the predictable behavior just by using an adverse name.

    It would seem evident that Bradly/”fanofVan”, has continued in his attempt to distract the subject, or to high-jack a subject, specifically when confronted with questions, as to his current attitude, as he seems to present it. It does not surprise me for his attack, and redirection, more specifically after my previous post #27548, where I tended to pose him with personal questions that he refuses to answer, or comment on. In other instances where there have been some members of this forum who wished to open a subject, to further examine certain aspects of the rebellion, he seemed to be in the forefront to squash those type of subjects. This might have been something that I would have expected from “Van”, back in the day, and being that Bradly is a self proclaimed Fan of Van, it surprises me not. In my most recent study of the UB, it seemed that “Van” took it upon himself, to go against what Jesus presented, specifically the brotherhood of man, which in just indication would not have been available to “Van” in his time, so his actions which kept his fellow staff members isolated from the tree of life, literally resulting in their death, would not be totally subject to his mandate but also from the “Constellation Fathers” who sanctioned his appointment to the staff. Had it not of been for the isolation of communication, back to “Van”, from his appeal to the “Most Highs”, where it has been repeated over and over, that the “Most Highs” rule on “Urantia”, thereby it can be indicated that the “Constellation Fathers” rule on Urantia, where being that Michael had not finished His final bestowal, making Him the Sovereign of this universe, the “Constellation Fathers” were in control. This might also indicate that there is or was an infrastructure issue in the universe that many did not see? So, if the “Most Highs” ruled on Urantia, it could also be assumed that they did nothing to circumvent what Michael/Jesus had to deal with on His bestowal mission. Interesting to say the least. Had it not been for a recently found transmission from the “Most Highs” to “Van” giving him validation for his appeal, there is no telling what may have occurred.

    (760.4) 67:6.9 It should be recorded that, when Van appealed to the Most Highs of Edentia after Lucifer had sustained Caligastia on Urantia, the Constellation Fathers dispatched an immediate decision sustaining Van on every point of his contention. This verdict failed to reach him because the planetary circuits of communication were severed while it was in transit. Only recently was this actual ruling discovered lodged in the possession of a relay energy transmitter where it had been marooned ever since the isolation of Urantia. Without this discovery, made as the result of the investigations of the Urantia midwayers, the release of this decision would have awaited the restoration of Urantia to the constellation circuits. And this apparent accident of interplanetary communication was possible because energy transmitters can receive and transmit intelligence, but they cannot initiate communication. (760.5) 67:6.10 The technical status of Van on the legal records of Satania was not actually and finally settled until this ruling of the Edentia Fathers was recorded on Jerusem.

    So it would seem that based on the hierarchy at the time, “Van” went over the head of the current System Sovereign, to get validation from those beings who put him into the position that he held, which might indicate that he was a plant within the planetary regime. It is needless to say that I find “Van” a questionable character in the history of Urantia, more specifically that he would take it upon himself to play judge and jury, against his associates, which would have been the responsibility of the Ancient of Days.

    If that’s the case Midi, who planted him, since he was here on Urantia before the onset of the rebellion?

    Its not so much that he was planted, as it would have been approved.

    (749.2) 66:5.31 10. The supreme court of tribal co-ordination and racial co-operation. This supreme council was directed by Van and was the court of appeals for all of the other nine special commissions charged with the supervision of human affairs. This council was one of wide function, being intrusted with all matters of earthly concern which were not specifically assigned to the other groups. This selected corps had been approved by the Constellation Fathers of Edentia before they were authorized to assume the functions of the supreme court of Urantia.

    The Constellation Fathers would have the most to benefit from any rebellion, and being that they were also, involved with the assignment of Caligastia to Urantia, even after there were many other opportunities, for Planetary Prince, and where the final word for all assignments, as above, “Van” had to be approved even after being selected by Caligastia, and being that “Van” went directly to them to petition for an appeal, after Lucifer sustained “Van’s” appeal, regarding the same subject, would indicate that “Van” was working with the “Constellation Fathers” otherwise someone in “Vans” position would not have authority, not being a Son of God, to even address them, because it has been noted that the Most Highs do not involve themselves with individuals, so “Van” had to of had special dispensation to even contact them. Not to mention that, even though the return confirmation or communication was stopped, and that it was an immediate response, to “Van’s” appeal, would indicate that there had been additional communication in the past that might have been intelligence gathering and passed on. But I indicated that the Constellation Fathers had the most to gain, giving them additional control over the Universe where the following would indicates that with the passing ages they get more and more power where eventually they would be subject to only one, the Supreme Being, who would have no connection with Havona, or the current Trinity, as noted in paper 55 section 12. One would need to read down from the following in order to associate the “Constellation Fathers” to the Supreme.

    (633.6) 55:9.3 As the ages pass, the Constellation Fathers take over more and more of the detailed administrative or supervising functions which were formerly centered on the universe headquarters. By the attainment of the sixth stage of stabilization these unified constellations will have reached the position of well-nigh complete autonomy. Entrance upon the seventh stage of settledness will no doubt witness the exaltation of these rulers to the true dignity signified by their names, the Most Highs. To all intents and purposes the constellations will then deal directly with the superuniverse rulers, while the local universe government will expand to grasp the responsibilities of new grand universe obligations.

    Van acted in a crisis. He did what was right. If those of his brothers and sisters who aligned with the rebellion, by so doing, put themselves in a position to be unable to access the life sustaining fruit of the tree of life, well then, a light should have gone on in their rebellious little heads, like it probably did, but was ignored, to knock it off and get behind Van.

    You need to get your time-line set. At the time that the Tree of Life was acquired, rebellion was only assumed by “Van” and not yet officially declared, on Jerusem, although it was inevitable, that’s why “Van” appealed to Lucifer, and then to the “Most Highs”, and during his long-winded speech to the staff, and others, indicating that “Van” would send an appeal, which seemed to be a delay needed for action. Whether what he did was right, or wrong, did not fully pan out for seven years for everyone to make a decision, but his actions would have been premature if the majority elected to stay loyal. Therefore, it could be said that the theft of the Tree, was a bargaining chip or possible bribery, to force a favorable decision. Either way, “Van” took control prior to what was or was not a crisis, which took seven years to validate. Also, if there was nothing to hide, regarding this whole proceedings why were the records “obliterated”?

    (757.3) 67:3.10 There is no end to the recital of the stirring events of these tragic days. But at last the final decision of the last personality was made, and then, but only then, did a Most High of Edentia arrive with the emergency Melchizedeks to seize authority on Urantia. The Caligastia panoramic reign-records on Jerusem were obliterated, and the probationary era of planetary rehabilitation was inaugurated.

    Me here:  WRONG AGAIN Caligstia/Midi -Van and all the corporeal staff had loyally administered the affairs and their duties related to their mission following the will and direction of Caligastia, the Planetary Prince, for some 300,000 years.  Then this:
    1. The Caligastia Betrayal

    67:1.1 (754.2) For three hundred thousand years Caligastia had been in charge of Urantia when Satan, Lucifer’s assistant, made one of his periodic inspection calls. And when Satan arrived on the planet, his appearance in no way resembled your caricatures of his nefarious majesty. He was, and still is, a Lanonandek Son of great brilliance. “And no marvel, for Satan himself is a brilliant creature of light.”

    67:1.2 (754.3) In the course of this inspection Satan informed Caligastia of Lucifer’s then proposed “Declaration of Liberty,” and as we now know, the Prince agreed to betray the planet upon the announcement of the rebellion. The loyal universe personalities look with peculiar disdain upon Prince Caligastia because of this premeditated betrayal of trust. The Creator Son voiced this contempt when he said: “You are like your leader, Lucifer, and you have sinfully perpetuated his iniquity. He was a falsifier from the beginning of his self-exaltation because he abode not in the truth.”

    67:2.1 (755.3) Shortly after Satan’s inspection and when the planetary administration was on the eve of the realization of great things on Urantia, one day, midwinter of the northern continents, Caligastia held a prolonged conference with his associate, Daligastia, after which the latter called the ten councils of Urantia in session extraordinary. This assembly was opened with the statement that Prince Caligastia was about to proclaim himself absolute sovereign of Urantia and demanded that all administrative groups abdicate by resigning all of their functions and powers into the hands of Daligastia as trustee, pending the reorganization of the planetary government and the subsequent redistribution of these offices of administrative authority.

    67:2.2 (755.4) The presentation of this astounding demand was followed by the masterly appeal of Van, chairman of the supreme council of co-ordination. This distinguished administrator and able jurist branded the proposed course of Caligastia as an act bordering on planetary rebellion and appealed to his conferees to abstain from all participation until an appeal could be taken to Lucifer, the System Sovereign of Satania; and he won the support of the entire staff. Accordingly, appeal was taken to Jerusem, and forthwith came back the orders designating Caligastia as supreme sovereign on Urantia and commanding absolute and unquestioning allegiance to his mandates. And it was in reply to this amazing message that the noble Van made his memorable address of seven hours’ length in which he formally drew his indictment of Daligastia, Caligastia, and Lucifer as standing in contempt of the sovereignty of the universe of Nebadon; and he appealed to the Most Highs of Edentia for support and confirmation.

    Me here:  The “masterly appeal of Van”, Urantia’s Chief Justice of the Planetary Supreme Court, appeals first to the System HG which, of course, was rejected by the leader and originator of the rebellion – Lucifer, System Sovereign.  Then Van made his appeal to the next level of System/Constellation courts – the Supreme Court of Edentia – the Most Highs who rule in the kingdoms of local creation as is their jurisdiction.  All according to protocols, policies, and procedures of the Constellation and System administrative management and rule of law and justice and Van’s impeccable discernment and actions coincided with Gabriel’s own appeals and representation of Michael’s will in the matter.

    Then came the 7 years of conflict, both on Urantia and throughout the System, whereby and during, every creature and mind was given opportunity to decide for themselves whether to follow the rebel leadership or to stand firm against rebellion and the Lucifer’s declaration and manifesto declaring himself God, denying the Universal Father, and claiming Michael’s indifference and impotence.
    Gabriel’s loyalty was a certainty as Michael’s first born Son and Chief Executive of the entire Local Universe of Nebadon, always faithfully representing the mind, will, and voice of Nebadon’s Creator Son.  But Van?  And Amadon?  They exemplify the power of faith, trust, and loyalty by those who began life as material born creatures of the lowliest of origins.
    Early in the 7 Crucial Years of soul searching and the exposure of loyalists and rebels, the Tree of Life was saved for Van’s Loyalists:

    67:3.3 (756.4) The traitorous Prince marshaled the disloyal midway creatures and other groups of rebel personalities and organized them to execute his bidding, while Van assembled the loyal midwayers and other faithful groups and began the great battle for the salvation of the planetary staff and other marooned celestial personalities.

    67:3.4 (756.5) During the times of this struggle the loyalists dwelt in an unwalled and poorly protected settlement a few miles to the east of Dalamatia, but their dwellings were guarded day and night by the alert and ever-watchful loyal midway creatures, and they had possession of the priceless tree of life.

    67:3.5 (756.6) Upon the outbreak of rebellion, loyal cherubim and seraphim, with the aid of three faithful midwayers, assumed the custody of the tree of life and permitted only the forty loyalists of the staff and their associated modified mortals to partake of the fruit and leaves of this energy plant. There were fifty-six of these modified Andonite associates of the staff, sixteen of the Andonite attendants of the disloyal staff refusing to go into rebellion with their masters.

    67:3.6 (756.7) Throughout the seven crucial years of the Caligastia rebellion, Van was wholly devoted to the work of ministry to his loyal army of men, midwayers, and angels. The spiritual insight and moral steadfastness which enabled Van to maintain such an unshakable attitude of loyalty to the universe government was the product of clear thinking, wise reasoning, logical judgment, sincere motivation, unselfish purpose, intelligent loyalty, experiential memory, disciplined character, and the unquestioning dedication of his personality to the doing of the will of the Father in Paradise.

    ;-) :good:

    "Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."

  9. Hope to hear from others….but my presumption is “reflectivity” which would not be a “contradiction” at all: [. . ] How to ‘appear’ to be in more than one place at the same time!! Note the TA’s capabilities in this regard…was John actually at the scene he witnessed regarding his revelation? Nope. Ever heard of or studied this most practical functionalities in time and space?

    Actually Bradly, that would be a very good explanation, and if this “reflectivity” where only present in Jesus’ mind, I could accept it verbatim, however when one looks at this “phenomenon of reflectivity”, and examines the explanation, as is assumed in the UB, I could concur.  Being that these figures were also seem by other mortals, it would be interesting to know how these characters or figures appeared to be seen, and then one might assume that they left by the same means as they appeared.  Also, it would seem that the “phenomenon of reflectivity” is likened to a “virtual” projection, and should this be the case, a simultaneous projection to the minds in close proximity to this “phenomenon” but, Bradly, according to you, virtual projection does not exist, am I correct?  But now you say it does exist?  So, do these so called “phenomenon” only apply when it is to your benefit when attempting to discredit others of their understanding?  Either way, your explanation could be a viable answer to this implied contradiction, but until it is proven it would still be a “phenomenon”, unexplained.  Also, being that the entry in the UB, of this event experienced by Jesus and others, might pose this very question as to how it was possible to actually be done?  Therefore, it might have been advantageous, in order to not be confusing, that the authors indicated that this union of beings was possible by the method of “reflectivity”, therefore, still a contradiction, although in words only, but in order to explain this one would need to actually assume that this is something not said in the UB, so if it is not literally presented in print, it is not so.  Correct?  It did not say, literally that this appearance was the product of “reflectivity” so, your argument must also, literally be false. No?

  10. WRONG AGAIN Caligstia/Midi -Van and all the corporeal staff had loyally administered the affairs and their duties related to their mission following the will and direction of Caligastia, the Planetary Prince, for some 300,000 years.

    Okay, if those who are assumed to side with the rebellion, did not take some kind of oath of allegiance, then there would be no reason to hold them also responsible for their free-will choices.  Then regardless of their choosing, they could not be held responsible for their free-will choice, but they were, WHY?  If nothing was really done for seven years, or until everyone made a choice, it was because of their free-will choice, given by the the Universal Father, so who was it that made the accusation that they be adjudicated as rebels, if they only had one of two choices.  Could anyone have abstained from making a choice?  It would seem not.  So, they were forced to choose between one way or the other.  As it turned out the majority chose for ????, and they were convicted, prior to any evidence being presented.  They were guilty by proxy of choosing.

    Also, for any of the authors of the UB to indicate anything other than what has been presented, would also put them in contempt of court, so to speak.  So, being all third party information, and no real quotations, by the accused, much of the information must be assumed as skewed in favor of the accusers or prosecution, that’s why the representative of the virtual defence, objects.  But I know that this objection will be overruled, by the advocates of Van.

    Also, being that you bring up that for three hundred thousand years of being loyal to the so called plan, it would also be logical that the results of these years might have brought on the objection to what the plan was doing to those affected by this plan.  So, one would need to look at what was being done throughout this time that might have caused some sort of problem?

  11. So, one would need to look at what was being done throughout this time that might have caused some sort of problem?

    I’m looking at what you’re doing this time, to cause some sort of problem.

    I guess it’s just another part of your so-called plan.

     

     

     

  12. Really??!!  You wish to carry on this exposure of your character, lies, falsehoods, deceit, and representation of the Manifesto and your namesake Caligastia?  A rather stupid choice.  But it is yours to make!  Just to let you know, I will dog your trail of deceit so long as I am able and continue to show how small is your Big Brain and how large its arrogance of self puffery.  You’re batting about 0 for 100 here lately, every post an example of either your ignorance or your agenda.  I tire of you and those like you who lie about the Papers and do so in ways that belittle others and prevent the kinder and gentler voices to raise objection or expose your madness.  And mad you are as you defend the treachery of traitors and besmirch God and His universe and all those beloved creatures who remain faithful in their trust and faith.

    As Bonita said earlier:  “I had no idea . . .  it’s a shame such mental derangement exists in this world, but it does. Why it’s allowed on forums I’ll never understand.  They tell us that pity is only a partial manifestation of mercy.  To be honest, I can’t get past pity on this one.  How is it that there are enough mercy credits to cover this amount of evil?  Our God must be a truly wonderful God to have mercy on a person capable of such distorted thinking.  Of course, God loves the person and not the person’s perverted sins.  I might be able to do that . . . not sure.  In this case it really is sin because  has consciously chosen to act out his evil thoughts and share them with the world.  He laughs his behavior off calling it an experiment on the human mind. Like Josef Mengele? Personally, it makes me ill.  Sin will do that.”

    Me here:  Like your self chosen, free will motives, intentions, priorities, and words illustrate, you have chosen darkness and despair for yourself, embracing evil to now expose sin, even outright rebellion yourself, turning away from reality and toward irrelevancy.  Perhaps you might yet acknowledge your selfhood as it is and turn toward the light of truth, beauty, and goodness?  Your belief in your superiority mocks yourself and yet you are relentless to defend iniquity. Turn away from the darkness Midi/Caligastia while you may.

    53:9.8 (611.7) But for ages the seven prison worlds of spiritual darkness in Satania have constituted a solemn warning to all Nebadon, eloquently and effectively proclaiming the great truth “that the way of the transgressor is hard”; “that within every sin is concealed the seed of its own destruction”; that “the wages of sin is death.”

     

    Hope to hear from others….but my presumption is “reflectivity” which would not be a “contradiction” at all: [. . ] How to ‘appear’ to be in more than one place at the same time!! Note the TA’s capabilities in this regard…was John actually at the scene he witnessed regarding his revelation? Nope. Ever heard of or studied this most practical functionalities in time and space?

    Actually Bradly, that would be a very good explanation, and if this “reflectivity” where only present in Jesus’ mind, I could accept it verbatim, however when one looks at this “phenomenon of reflectivity”, and examines the explanation, as is assumed in the UB, I could concur. Being that these figures were also seem by other mortals, it would be interesting to know how these characters or figures appeared to be seen, and then one might assume that they left by the same means as they appeared. Also, it would seem that the “phenomenon of reflectivity” is likened to a “virtual” projection, and should this be the case, a simultaneous projection to the minds in close proximity to this “phenomenon” but, Bradly, according to you, virtual projection does not exist, am I correct? But now you say it does exist? So, do these so called “phenomenon” only apply when it is to your benefit when attempting to discredit others of their understanding? Either way, your explanation could be a viable answer to this implied contradiction, but until it is proven it would still be a “phenomenon”, unexplained. Also, being that the entry in the UB, of this event experienced by Jesus and others, might pose this very question as to how it was possible to actually be done? Therefore, it might have been advantageous, in order to not be confusing, that the authors indicated that this union of beings was possible by the method of “reflectivity”, therefore, still a contradiction, although in words only, but in order to explain this one would need to actually assume that this is something not said in the UB, so if it is not literally presented in print, it is not so. Correct? It did not say, literally that this appearance was the product of “reflectivity” so, your argument must also, literally be false. No?

    NO!!  I have never said there is no reflectivity or even ‘virtual’ projections.  YOU claimed the Morontia Worlds and experience were virtual, another lie and falsehood, as verified by several students here by the posting of appropriate text confirming the very real and physical realities of the Mansion Worlds and all other architectural spheres.  Then you tried to claim such worlds to be spaceships of transport.  It seems you have an endless stream of inventions and falsehoods for every turn of your deceptions!  Again…no contradiction – real, implied, or virtual.  But don’t give up there Caligastia.  And you don’t.

    WRONG AGAIN Caligstia/Midi -Van and all the corporeal staff had loyally administered the affairs and their duties related to their mission following the will and direction of Caligastia, the Planetary Prince, for some 300,000 years.

    Okay, if those who are assumed to side with the rebellion, did not take some kind of oath of allegiance, then there would be no reason to hold them also responsible for their free-will choices. Then regardless of their choosing, they could not be held responsible for their free-will choice, but they were, WHY? If nothing was really done for seven years, or until everyone made a choice, it was because of their free-will choice, given by the the Universal Father, so who was it that made the accusation that they be adjudicated as rebels, if they only had one of two choices. Could anyone have abstained from making a choice? It would seem not. So, they were forced to choose between one way or the other. As it turned out the majority chose for ????, and they were convicted, prior to any evidence being presented. They were guilty by proxy of choosing. Also, for any of the authors of the UB to indicate anything other than what has been presented, would also put them in contempt of court, so to speak. So, being all third party information, and no real quotations, by the accused, much of the information must be assumed as skewed in favor of the accusers or prosecution, that’s why the representative of the virtual defence, objects. But I know that this objection will be overruled, by the advocates of Van. Also, being that you bring up that for three hundred thousand years of being loyal to the so called plan, it would also be logical that the results of these years might have brought on the objection to what the plan was doing to those affected by this plan. So, one would need to look at what was being done throughout this time that might have caused some sort of problem?

    Actually, many or nearly all of the celestials and corporeal staff did indeed repent and entered voluntary rehabilitation as it is understood they were deceived and loyalties confused and with poor judgement based on immaturity and lack of wisdom and experience were DECEIVED by their System Sovereign, his lieutenant Satan, and a few Planetary rulers/Princes.  Only the most wicked and twisted have refused to acknowledge their iniquities, disloyalties, betrayals, deceptions, and horrific claims…kind of like you Midi/Cali!

    53:9.1 (610.6) Early in the days of the Lucifer rebellion, salvation was offered all rebels by Michael. To all who would show proof of sincere repentance, he offered, upon his attainment of complete universe sovereignty, forgiveness and reinstatement in some form of universe service. None of the leaders accepted this merciful proffer. But thousands of the angels and the lower orders of celestial beings, including hundreds of the Material Sons and Daughters, accepted the mercy proclaimed by the Panoptians and were given rehabilitation at the time of Jesus’ resurrection nineteen hundred years ago. These beings have since been transferred to the Father’s world of Jerusem, where they must be held, technically, until the Uversa courts hand down a decision in the matter of Gabriel vs. Lucifer. But no one doubts that, when the annihilation verdict is issued, these repentant and salvaged personalities will be exempted from the decree of extinction. These probationary souls now labor with the Panoptians in the work of caring for the Father’s world.

    There has been no conviction and there is no need for trial really….just fair hearing and the evidence provided by…..drum roll…..reflectivity!  Do you not know Midi/Cali that no one may hide anything from God?  No thought, no motive, no intention, no lust, no lie, nothing may be or can be hidden.  “Third party information”??  Hearsay?  Rumor?  Gossip?  False witness?  Skewed?  Really??!!  You think any of that exists in heaven?  You poor soul you.  There you have it….either total ignorance or complete arrogance…still and again, or is it both ignorance + arrogance?  Big brain indeed!

    Do you think those who repented and accepted the grace of Divine mercy and love and the embrace of reality perhaps faked it?   Hahahahahahha….what a sense of humor you have.  We well know the cause of “the problem” Caligastia!  It’s written in plain English.  Don’t know why you don’t understand it….well, sorry, that’s a fib….you do not wish to understand or accept that what the authors of the Papers write is truth.  You accuse them of lying and conspiracy and cover-up and their skillful manipulation of God.  Sorry, can’t help it….hahahahahahahhaha.

    2. The Causes of Rebellion

    53:2.1 (602.4) Lucifer and his first assistant, Satan, had reigned on Jerusem for more than five hundred thousand years when in their hearts they began to array themselves against the Universal Father and his then vicegerent Son, Michael.

    53:2.2 (602.5) There were no peculiar or special conditions in the system of Satania which suggested or favored rebellion. It is our belief that the idea took origin and form in Lucifer’s mind, and that he might have instigated such a rebellion no matter where he might have been stationed. Lucifer first announced his plans to Satan, but it required several months to corrupt the mind of his able and brilliant associate. However, when once converted to the rebel theories, he became a bold and earnest advocate of “self-assertion and liberty.”

    53:2.3 (602.6) No one ever suggested rebellion to Lucifer. The idea of self-assertion in opposition to the will of Michael and to the plans of the Universal Father, as they are represented in Michael, had its origin in his own mind. His relations with the Creator Son had been intimate and always cordial. At no time prior to the exaltation of his own mind did Lucifer openly express dissatisfaction about the universe administration. Notwithstanding his silence, for more than one hundred years of standard time the Union of Days on Salvington had been reflectivating to Uversa that all was not at peace in Lucifer’s mind. This information was also communicated to the Creator Son and the Constellation Fathers of Norlatiadek.

    53:2.4 (602.7) Throughout this period Lucifer became increasingly critical of the entire plan of universe administration but always professed wholehearted loyalty to the Supreme Rulers. His first outspoken disloyalty was manifested on the occasion of a visit of Gabriel to Jerusem just a few days before the open proclamation of the Lucifer Declaration of Liberty. Gabriel was so profoundly impressed with the certainty of the impending outbreak that he went direct to Edentia to confer with the Constellation Fathers regarding the measures to be employed in case of open rebellion.

    53:2.5 (603.1) It is very difficult to point out the exact cause or causes which finally culminated in the Lucifer rebellion. We are certain of only one thing, and that is: Whatever these first beginnings were, they had their origin in Lucifer’s mind. There must have been a pride of self that nourished itself to the point of self-deception, so that Lucifer for a time really persuaded himself that his contemplation of rebellion was actually for the good of the system, if not of the universe. By the time his plans had developed to the point of disillusionment, no doubt he had gone too far for his original and mischief-making pride to permit him to stop. At some point in this experience he became insincere, and evil evolved into deliberate and willful sin. That this happened is proved by the subsequent conduct of this brilliant executive. He was long offered opportunity for repentance, but only some of his subordinates ever accepted the proffered mercy. The Faithful of Days of Edentia, on the request of the Constellation Fathers, in person presented the plan of Michael for the saving of these flagrant rebels, but always was the mercy of the Creator Son rejected and rejected with increasing contempt and disdain.

    3. The Lucifer Manifesto

    53:3.1 (603.2) Whatever the early origins of trouble in the hearts of Lucifer and Satan, the final outbreak took form as the Lucifer Declaration of Liberty. The cause of the rebels was stated under three heads:

    53:3.2 (603.3) 1. The reality of the Universal Father. Lucifer charged that the Universal Father did not really exist, that physical gravity and space-energy were inherent in the universe, and that the Father was a myth invented by the Paradise Sons to enable them to maintain the rule of the universes in the Father’s name. He denied that personality was a gift of the Universal Father. He even intimated that the finaliters were in collusion with the Paradise Sons to foist fraud upon all creation since they never brought back a very clear-cut idea of the Father’s actual personality as it is discernible on Paradise. He traded on reverence as ignorance. The charge was sweeping, terrible, and blasphemous. It was this veiled attack upon the finaliters that no doubt influenced the ascendant citizens then on Jerusem to stand firm and remain steadfast in resistance to all the rebel’s proposals.

    53:3.3 (603.4) 2. The universe government of the Creator Son — Michael. Lucifer contended that the local systems should be autonomous. He protested against the right of Michael, the Creator Son, to assume sovereignty of Nebadon in the name of a hypothetical Paradise Father and require all personalities to acknowledge allegiance to this unseen Father. He asserted that the whole plan of worship was a clever scheme to aggrandize the Paradise Sons. He was willing to acknowledge Michael as his Creator-father but not as his God and rightful ruler.

    53:3.4 (603.5) Most bitterly did he attack the right of the Ancients of Days — “foreign potentates” — to interfere in the affairs of the local systems and universes. These rulers he denounced as tyrants and usurpers. He exhorted his followers to believe that none of these rulers could do aught to interfere with the operation of complete home rule if men and angels only had the courage to assert themselves and boldly claim their rights.

    53:3.5 (603.6) He contended that the executioners of the Ancients of Days could be debarred from functioning in the local systems if the native beings would only assert their independence. He maintained that immortality was inherent in the system personalities, that resurrection was natural and automatic, and that all beings would live eternally except for the arbitrary and unjust acts of the executioners of the Ancients of Days.

    53:3.6 (604.1) 3. The attack upon the universal plan of ascendant mortal training. Lucifer maintained that far too much time and energy were expended upon the scheme of so thoroughly training ascending mortals in the principles of universe administration, principles which he alleged were unethical and unsound. He protested against the agelong program for preparing the mortals of space for some unknown destiny and pointed to the presence of the finaliter corps on Jerusem as proof that these mortals had spent ages of preparation for some destiny of pure fiction. With derision he pointed out that the finaliters had encountered a destiny no more glorious than to be returned to humble spheres similar to those of their origin. He intimated that they had been debauched by overmuch discipline and prolonged training, and that they were in reality traitors to their mortal fellows since they were now co-operating with the scheme of enslaving all creation to the fictions of a mythical eternal destiny for ascending mortals. He advocated that ascenders should enjoy the liberty of individual self-determination. He challenged and condemned the entire plan of mortal ascension as sponsored by the Paradise Sons of God and supported by the Infinite Spirit.

    53:3.7 (604.2) And it was with such a Declaration of Liberty that Lucifer launched his orgy of darkness and death.

     

    Me here:  I recall you recently claimed God the Supreme to be only “hypothetical”….interesting.  You tread dangerous waters.  Very dangerous….please turn back to the shore of reality and truth Caligastia….before the mill stone arrives!

    Anything else????

    "Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."

  13. Sorry, can’t help it….hahahahahahahhaha.

    It would seem, Bradly that this has become a joke to you.

    However, I recently had the opportunity to re-watch the 1960 movie “Inherit the Wind”, made from a play of the same name.  You may remember it as “The Great Monkey Trial” or from the original trail, “Scopes Trial” — “The State of Tennessee v. John Thomas Scopes“, which challenged the “Tennessee — Butler Act” of 1925.  It wasn’t a joke then, but had they of had the UB back then, the UB could have been used to prove that evolution does exist, and that we as humans came from monkeys, more specifically lemurs.

    So, in the same trial, the defence Attorney was ridiculed, and being against God, but being an agnostic, he originally refused because he was concerned that the trail would become a joke.

    Nevertheless, whether I believe that the rebels are or are not guilty of what is claimed in the UB, I do believe that everyone is deserving of some form of defence.  Which also entitles you to your right of opinion or to prosecute your belief.

  14. The truth is never a joke….but your false claims and refusal or inabilityto understand or accept plain English while claiming your own superiority does offer its form of humor.  If you wish to be taken seriously, then say something serious….and meaningful….and within or from the text….that is not pure distortion, fantasy, and misrepresentation!

    You accuse the heavenly rulers of all manner of mortal ills and vices.  That IS a joke!   :-)

     

    Anything else?

     

    "Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."

  15. You accuse the heavenly rulers of all manner of mortal ills and vices. That IS a joke!

    Anything else?

    There is always something else, Bradly, where regardless of response, you will always attempt to present the last word.

    You are the one making accusations by judging anyone who attempts to present their free-will right to speak, in that, if all do not swear allegiance to your god, they must suffer the wrath of your tongue or pen?  You mention above “heavenly rules” as a plural collective entity, where my allegiance is to the Father of All, as presented through Jesus’ teachings, and does not require swearing oaths to lesser gods in order to receive the bestowal of free-will.  It would seem that you have sworn your allegiance to the less gods who rule by proxy as they interpret the Father of All’s implied mandate to be perfect, yet if the Most Highs rule on Earth as it is in heaven, then the evidence of their rule can be seen throughout its history.  The actuality to make positive change has been passed onto us, as indicated in the text of the UB, yet you persist to accept the failing infrastructure of heaven, where it would seem that they also need to make changes for if “as above, so below” is any evidence of what is “above” as we experience “below”, there is much work to be done, “below” in order to change the “above”, as well.

    I await your last word, condemning all who do not ally themselves with your gods.  Have a nice day, where others continue to suffer. You propose accepting mercy, which seems conditional, rather than forgiveness, where mercy seems always conditioned on action, and follows that if you are not with us you are against us, which allows no quarter to judgment. Therefore, in kind, if one is not with Bradly they are against Bradly, and if against Bradly, against his gods.

    (1584.2) 140:9.3 Jesus advised them to take neither money nor extra clothing, saying, “The laborer is worthy of his hire.” And finally he said: “Behold I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves; be you therefore as wise as serpents and as harmless as doves. But take heed, for your enemies will bring you up before their councils, while in their synagogues they will castigate you. Before governors and rulers you will be brought because you believe this gospel, and your very testimony shall be a witness for me to them. And when they lead you to judgment, be not anxious about what you shall say, for the spirit of my Father indwells you and will at such a time speak through you. Some of you will be put to death, and before you establish the kingdom on earth, you will be hated by many peoples because of this gospel; but fear not; I will be with you, and my spirit shall go before you into all the world. And my Father’s presence will abide with you while you go first to the Jews, then to the gentiles.”

    One must consider that even as Jesus indicates here “my Father”, being as the UB indicates, if Michael were the Father, or in this case God, He could not be referring to a plural of Gods only One, who was not Christ/Michael, otherwise He would have made reference to Himself.  But the reference to “governors and rulers” could just as easily be associated to the “Most Highs” who rule?

  16. Perhaps I misunderstood your words Midi when you called me stupid (and all others here but yourself) and me also the leader of the death squad pack?  And did I misunderstand your defense of and justification for Lucifer and his minions in their denial of the existence of God – not the “lesser gods” but THE God Almighty himself, only to declare himself god over all?  And do you think an oath is required for the bestowal of free will…really?  It would seem your allegiance suffers by declaring there is no free will and God’s universe a scary and dysfunctional place where rumor, innuendo, false witness, conspiracy, unfairness, injustice, and a lack of due process and mercy leave victims it its wake….as it fails.

    And why do you reference the UB at all?  You do not appear to believe anything at all that it says about anything.  What “positive change” do aspire to in your deceptions about the contents of the UB and the conspiracies you present even though each is a direct contradiction of the Papers?   Especially so your claimed “failing infrastructure of heaven”?  Good Grief man.  What a distorted perspective and so contrary to that we share and study here together.

    God is a failure?  As is Michael?  And yet you claim allegiance?  Perplexing indeed.  But still you claim your own superiority.  I claim only the UB says what it says….and I believe what it says.  Obviously you do not.  Very well.  But how can you claim to use the UB as an authority for any information when you don’t believe a word it says?  Very odd.  Anything else?

    "Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."

  17. Actually Bradly, when one twists an others words, without quoting them in full context, would indicate there own sub-conscious intent, or true feelings.  The fact that you accuse, through your own twisting of words, shows either a pure mis-understanding of others and that if there was no truth in what others present, then the only way to change this truth is to distort the truth, to reflect one’s own sub-conscious thought.  Your accusations, and personalized defence of misunderstood knowledge, indicated that you believe that there is truth in what is being presented, yet being necessary to present disinformation to change, by twisting that information which reflects back to yourself.  In other words, your words against others, reflects back to yourself as you are in actuality.  Transference back to oneself.

    (309.5) 28:4.11 4. The Voice of the Angelic Hosts. The fourth primary seconaphim and every seventh serial prove to be angels peculiarly responsive to the sentiments of all orders of angels, including the supernaphim above and the seraphim below. Thus the attitude of any commanding or supervising angel is immediately available for consideration at any council of the Ancients of Days. Never a day passes on your world that the chief of seraphim on Urantia is not made conscious of the phenomenon of reflective transference, of being drawn upon from Uversa for some purpose; but unless forewarned by a Solitary Messenger, she remains wholly ignorant of what is sought and of how it is secured. These ministering spirits of time are constantly furnishing this sort of unconscious and certainly, therefore, unprejudiced testimony concerning the endless array of matters engaging the attention and counsel of the Ancients of Days and their associates.

    6. Repercussions of Finite Reality

    (1159.1) 105:6.1 The entire promulgation of finite existences represents a transference from potentials to actuals
    within the absolute associations of functional infinity. Of the many repercussions to creative actualization of
    the finite, there may be cited:

    (1159.2) 105:6.2 1. The deity response, the appearance of the three levels of experiential supremacy: the actuality of personal-spirit supremacy in Havona, the potential for personal-power supremacy in the grand universe to be, and the capacity for some unknown function of experiential mind acting on some level of supremacy in the future master universe.

    (1159.3) 105:6.3 2. The universe response involved an activation of the architectural plans for the superuniverse space level, and this evolution is still progressing throughout the physical organization of the seven superuniverses.

    (1159.4) 105:6.4 3. The creature repercussion to finite-reality promulgation resulted in the appearance of perfect beings on the order of the eternal inhabitants of Havona and of perfected evolutionary ascenders from the seven superuniverses. But to attain perfection as an evolutionary (time-creative) experience implies something other-than-perfection as a point of departure. Thus arises imperfection in the evolutionary creations. And this is the origin of potential evil. Misadaptation, disharmony, and conflict, all these things are inherent in evolutionary growth, from physical universes to personal creatures.

    (1159.5) 105:6.5 4. The divinity response to the imperfection inherent in the time lag of evolution is disclosed in the compensating presence of God the Sevenfold, by whose activities that which is perfecting is integrated with both the perfect and the perfected. This time lag is inseparable from evolution, which is creativity in time. Because of it, as well as for other reasons, the almighty power of the Supreme is predicated on the divinity successes of God the Sevenfold. This time lag makes possible creature participation in divine creation by permitting creature personalities to become partners with Deity in the attainment of maximum development. Even the material mind of the mortal creature thus becomes partner with the divine Adjuster in the dualization of the immortal soul. God the Sevenfold also provides techniques of compensation for the experiential limitations of inherent perfection as well as compensating the preascension limitations of imperfection.

  18. Hi Midi — some of your long sentences can be hard to follow.  Could you try to write in a way that’s easier for us to understand, so that your true meaning will be easier to decipher?

    Otherwise, some of your comments can be misconstrued to be… quite disturbing.

    with thanks – Nigel

    PS: did my paper on the “Lanonandek Dilemma” (attached above) help to explain why I called Lanonandeks… “Michael’s most fragile babies” ?

  19. Hi Midi — some of your long sentences can be hard to follow. Could you try to write in a way that’s easier for us to understand, so that your true meaning will be easier to decipher?

    Otherwise, some of your comments can be misconstrued to be… quite disturbing.

    with thanks – Nigel

    PS: did my paper on the “Lanonandek Dilemma” (attached above) help to explain why I called Lanonandeks… “Michael’s most fragile babies” ?

    “Nigel Nunn”, thanks for the input, where I am aware of the issue you indicate, and although difficult when in construction, of thought, where their is often more than one mindal image being presented, I use commas, in order to separate, but also to stay inclusive of the general thought flow, where which many have a tendency to overlook these commas, intended to pause the flow, and even some of these commas, could be replaced with periods, however, when one does so, the separation of thought might be interpreted differently.  I am aware of the problem, and strive to be more cognizant of it, going back over, sometimes editing, it often is better to leave it alone.  I would suggest using the commas as a larger pause period, which then might help in the context of the narration.

    Regarding your presentation, “Lanonandek Dilemma”, I have chanced to examine its content and can see where you are going with the implication presented therein.  I personally believe that the “dilemma” is more with the “Melchizedek and Vorondadek brothers.”  This being that the Lanonandek’s were created in order to be closer to the mortal creatures, and as you present that they may be more susceptible to corruption, so to speak, it would seem that their intermediary affect, much like the Midwayers, is not being recognized by the Vorondadek.  In that they do not consider, as being of viable significance, especially when there seem to be errors, resultant from their mandated function, and from the Lanonandek’s, based on their observations. What may be present as rebellion, may only be an inference for needed change.  The Melchizedek’s and Vorondadek’s, seem to look upon this as going against their imposed legislative laws, or mandates, and would seem that they should reason why there is opposition, in order to either better define the details of their legislative acts, being implemented for the benefit of those who they have no direct connection with.  It would seem that Lanonandek’s provide feedback along with implementation of so called laws, presented by Vorondadek’s but they are not willing to admit that those laws either need change, or need additional work, being that they will work for all, not admitting that now there are differences from the past.

    Therefore, being that Lanonandek’s are closer to the problems, their input is necessary because evolutionary changes are not seen nor understood by Vorondadek’s, mainly because there is no presidence to work from.  Therein lies the dilemma, or so I think.

    As to the “Michael’s most fragile babies”, I haven’t gotten that fare in your presentation but, other than changing that statement to indicate that it is Michael’s baby, as fare as being his final decision, it should not be considered “fragile”?

  20. Well…here I sit, slowly working through a generous portion of humble pie….one I made and served up to myself….yet again.  Haha.  Since I acted out here, I thought I should acknowledge my display(s) of immaturity and thank the group for your support and indulgence of my imposition on you all here as well.

    Regardless of cause (and there’s been plenty of that), I have been rude, mean spirited, belligerent, personal, sarcastic, caustic, and a little crazy…for which there is no excuse….except immaturity and self importance on my part!

    We are not always responsible for the circumstances and situations and challenges we face in life, but we are responsible for our responses at every intersection of choice, no matter the cause for those.  I have well demonstrated the need to improve my own response-ability.  The Master taught that sin and evil were not to be met passively nor are they to be defended against or assaulted by more sin and evil….the old wise as a serpent and harmless as a dove thing.  Error and even personal attack is to be faced with a compassionate and love based response that overcomes, diverts, and diminishes both the causes and the effects of that evil which confronts us, even assails us, including those who revile and demean us.  There have been some good examples of a greater wisdom than my own here….and I appreciate those very much.

    Reading my recent posts shows how much this tadpole has to learn in such regard.  Self defensiveness requires ‘self’ to be at the center of the response.  To punish those who assault me and insult me requires, again, that self importance motivate the response.  There are those who deliver up challenging opportunities for learning and teaching but neither of those is served by acrimony and/or self importance.

    This is not an apology….but is an acknowledgement for my own bad form and detrimental attitudes which only detract from whatever truth might be contained in such an ugly wrapper.  Better for the tadpole to change and progress than endlessly apologize for every transgression.  It is a fact that such bad form victimizes the community here and not just the target of my frustration and exasperation and I do regret that.

    So I chew on this pie with contemplation on how this experience might deliver greater wisdom and far better response-ability going forward.  Be assured such potential growth is incremental and I will surely disappoint again.  But I did not want my friends here to think I am blind to my own failures nor indifferent to the demands of experiential growth and greater wisdom by my mistakes.

    Time to re-boot and try again…with vigor and sincerity….and far less self at the center of all responses to all situations.

    Laughing at my own self importance and how ridiculous I can be:

    48:4.15 (549.2) When we are tempted to magnify our self-importance, if we stop to contemplate the infinity of the greatness and grandeur of our Makers, our own self-glorification becomes sublimely ridiculous, even verging on the humorous. One of the functions of humor is to help all of us take ourselves less seriously. Humor is the divine antidote for exaltation of ego.

    ;-)

    "Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."

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