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Problematic revelation on Celestial Guardians…

69 posts · 5 participants · started Aug 19, 2017, 3:05 PM

Brooklyn_bornParticipant
Aug 19, 2017, 9:56 PM
But you keep making my point when you reference these revelations. Even here it is telling you that these “new beings” are a child drawn from “time and eternity.” They are not new beings in the literal sense as they already exist. These are mortals who reach a certain level in the universe and then qualify to be transformed or trinitized by a Finaliter and Paradise Citizen.

Bonita wrote:

Here they call a brand spanking new personality born by the technique of creature-trinitization performed by two parents (finaliter and Paradise Citizen) a “child of time and eternity”.

23:4.3 When a finaliter and a Paradise Citizen co-operate in the trinitization of a “child of time and eternity” – a transaction involving the unrevealed mind potentials of the Supreme-Ultimate – and when such an unclassified personality is dispatched to Vicegerington, a Solitary Messenger (a conjectured personality repercussion of the bestowal of such deity mind) is always assigned as guardian-companion to such a creature-trinitized son. This messenger accompanies the new son of destiny to the world of his assignment and nevermore leaves Vicegerington. When thus attached to the destinies of a child of time and eternity, a Solitary Messenger is forever transferred to the sole supervision of the Architects of the Master Universe. What the future of such an extraordinary association may be, we do not know. For ages these partnerships of unique personalities have continued to forgather on Vicegerington, but not even a single pair has ever gone forth therefrom.

BB
Brooklyn_bornParticipant
Aug 19, 2017, 9:57 PM
You are supplying quotes that don’t even support what you are saying. In fact, they contradict you.

Bonita wrote:

Brooklyn_born wrote:

Those who are trinitized, for example, mortals, apply the technique of trinitization to achieve this state.

It’s the birth of an entirely new being and the parents enjoy a state of bi-unification. There are three beings involved in creature-trinitization: two parents and an offspring. I already supplied the quotes, which are: 22:7.7-9.

BB
AnonymousInactive
Aug 19, 2017, 10:14 PM

Brooklyn_born wrote:

There are trinity origin beings and trinitized beings. Those who are trinitized, for example, mortals, apply the technique of trinitization to achieve this state. However, we have yet to satisfactorily address the revelator’s statement on celestial guardians never having been Adjuster indwelt (perhaps infused is what is meant). I find that problematic as there is no direct explanation why mortals are included. The only logical explanation I can come up with is that the previous life is stricken from the records once transformation occurs.

BB, what I have found problematic, is in some of the wording found in the UB, where to take your query above a little further where you indicate “celestial guardians” would also imply with “guardian” angelic in nature. In the following UB quotes I found the phrase “men and angels” as curious where if one were to mean “man and angels” then it would be inclusive of “man” being human or man kind in general but when indicated as “men and angel” implies gender specific.

(430.1) 39:2.5 2. The Voice of Mercy. Mercy is the keynote of seraphic service and angelic ministry. It is therefore fitting that there should be a corps of angels who, in a special manner, portray mercy. These seraphim are the real mercy ministers of the local universes. They are the inspired leaders who foster the higher impulses and holier emotions of men and angels. The directors of these legions are now always completion seraphim who are also graduate guardians of mortal destiny; that is, each angelic pair has guided at least one soul of animal origin during the life in the flesh and has subsequently traversed the circles of Seraphington and has been mustered into the Seraphic Corps of Completion.

Above it uses “men and angels” and also indicates that angels also have “emotions” where in the next quote(s), both “man” and “men” is used which indicates a possible difference?

(1248.6) 113:7.6 Man and angel may or may not be reunited in eternal service, but wherever seraphic assignment may take them, the seraphim are always in communication with their former wards of the evolutionary worlds, the ascendant mortals of time. The intimate associations and the affectionate attachments of the realms of human origin are never forgotten nor ever completely severed. In the eternal ages men and angels will co-operate in the divine service as they did in the career of time.

(1249.1) 113:7.7 For seraphim, the surest way of achieving the Paradise Deities is by successfully guiding a soul of evolutionary origin to the portals of Paradise. Therefore is the assignment of guardian of destiny the most highly prized seraphic duty.

(1249.2) 113:7.8 Only destiny guardians are mustered into the primary or mortal Corps of the Finality, and such pairs have engaged in the supreme adventure of identity at-oneness; the two beings have achieved spiritual bi-unification on Seraphington prior to their reception into the finaliter corps. In this experience the two angelic natures, so complemental in all universe functions, achieve ultimate spirit two-in-oneness, repercussing in a new capacity for the reception of, and fusion with, a non-Adjuster fragment of the Paradise Father. And so do some of your loving seraphic associates in so become your finaliter associates in eternity, children of the Supreme and perfected sons of the Paradise Father.

One might consider that if “men and angels” is a gender reference it might indicate that, where “angels” is considered feminine that woman could be considered as angelic.

There are some text found elsewhere, specifically in the American Indian Creation stories, that have indicated that men and women had separated at one point in time and that later they found that they could not exist one without the other, so it might indicate that the implication in the UB that men had oppressed women, as is still in some cases an issue, that the joining between men and women, as compliments one to another may be significant to what is implied by the use of “men and angles” as referred to in the UB.

Therefore, the indication of the trinitization of some beings may indicate that it may also be gender specific and that “guardian” may imply a union between men and angel? When one receives a personal guardian of destiny, could this also refer to a method of trinitization?
BonitaParticipant
Aug 19, 2017, 10:15 PM

Brooklyn_born wrote:

You are supplying quotes that don’t even support what you are saying. In fact, they contradict you.

Where’s the contradiction? Both Bradly and I understand it. And I thank him for pointing out that very important word “offspring”.

I know you want to think of a new being as an old being that has been transformed, but that’s not what they are saying. It’s a separate personality altogether. A transformed person has the same personality since personalities never change. Quote 22:7.7 states that there are TWO ancestors (parents) of a creature-trinitized son. If this new son is just a transformation, which of the two personalities does he keep? He can’t keep both. In quote 22:7.9 it clearly states that both of the parents of this new creature-trinitized son maintain their own separate personalities. Since all personality is unique, how can an offspring take one or the other of its parents’ personality? Can’t be done.
BradlyParticipant
Aug 19, 2017, 10:18 PM

Brooklyn_born wrote:

You should have kept on reading, Bonita. This is what you missed out on…

22:7.4 The ascendant Adjuster-fused mortal finaliters who have attained certain levels of Paradise culture and spiritual development are among those who can essay to trinitize a creature being.

Again, and as Bradly grudgingly admits (smiles at Bradly), they are trinitizing beings that already exist; they are transforming these beings into a “new being.”

Bonita wrote:

Yup, here’s another quote that states a brand spanking new critter is the result of creature-trinitization. Did I already post this quote? Can’t remember. Old-timers disease has set in.

22:7.2 Aside from the Deities, only Paradise-Havona personalities and certain members of each of the finaliter corps engage in trinitization. Under specialized conditions of Paradise perfection, these superb beings may embark upon the unique adventure of concept-identity, and they are many times successful in the production of a new being, a creature-trinitized son.

Sorry BB but you misunderstand me…and trinitization…and I find no contradiction within Bonita’s posts or text. Finaliters are Trinity Embraced….we finaliters are embraced by the Trinity (such ones would be transformed by the process). Guardians (and others) are Creature Trinitized and are created by a non-sexual liaison by Trinitized Creatures….they are new beings created by trinitized creatures. Like I said before, think of how midwayers come to be.

There’s an attempt here to homogenize all trinitization and that’s not what’s being described at all. Bonita’s post indicates these Guardians will accompany finaliters to the outer levels once the Supreme is completed by the current time and space experiential perfecting adventure.

Deity trinitized Sons are created by Deity trinitization. Finaliters already exist but once embraced by Trinity (trinitization), they too may cocreate and procreate….the Guardians are one such form described as being created by such procreation by those in the Corps of Finality who have been Trinity embraced. I think the text is clear enough and describes an exciting potential for Agondonters especially!!

"Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."
Brooklyn_bornParticipant
Aug 19, 2017, 10:19 PM
Bradly understands and admits it here:

Greetings Bonita….and thank you! The Guardians are the children of trinitized beings and while becoming trinitized could be described as a transformative event I believe it is an enhanced perspective and capability delivered by the embrace of those so selected (and that is far more than being ‘born again’ which is the mortal mind’s commitment to spiritization – as finaliters the commitment was finalized by finality and only recognized by name and number upon fusion):

These are not brand spanking new beings. They already exist, Bonita.

Bonita wrote:

Brooklyn_born wrote:

You are supplying quotes that don’t even support what you are saying. In fact, they contradict you.

Where’s the contradiction? Both Bradly and I understand it. And I thank him for pointing out that very important word “offspring”. I know you want to think of a new being as an old being that has been transformed, but that’s not what they are saying. It’s a separate personality altogether. A transformed person has the same personality since personalities never change. Quote 22:7.7 states that there are TWO ancestors (parents) of a creature-trinitized son. If this new son is just a transformation, which of the two personalities does he keep? He can’t keep both. In quote 22:7.9 it clearly states that both of the parents of this new creature-trinitized son maintain their own separate personalities. Since all personality is unique, how can an offspring take one or the other of its parents’ personality? Can’t be done.

BB
Brooklyn_bornParticipant
Aug 19, 2017, 10:21 PM
Your words, Bradly, not mine:

Greetings Bonita….and thank you! The Guardians are the children of trinitized beings and while becoming trinitized could be described as a transformative event I believe it is an enhanced perspective and capability delivered by the embrace of those so selected (and that is far more than being ‘born again’ which is the mortal mind’s commitment to spiritization – as finaliters the commitment was finalized by finality and only recognized by name and number upon fusion):

Apparently you forgot what you said

Bradly wrote:

Brooklyn_born wrote:

You should have kept on reading, Bonita. This is what you missed out on…

22:7.4 The ascendant Adjuster-fused mortal finaliters who have attained certain levels of Paradise culture and spiritual development are among those who can essay to trinitize a creature being.

Again, and as Bradly grudgingly admits (smiles at Bradly), they are trinitizing beings that already exist; they are transforming these beings into a “new being.”

Bonita wrote:

Yup, here’s another quote that states a brand spanking new critter is the result of creature-trinitization. Did I already post this quote? Can’t remember. Old-timers disease has set in.

22:7.2 Aside from the Deities, only Paradise-Havona personalities and certain members of each of the finaliter corps engage in trinitization. Under specialized conditions of Paradise perfection, these superb beings may embark upon the unique adventure of concept-identity, and they are many times successful in the production of a new being, a creature-trinitized son.

Sorry BB but you misunderstand me…and trinitization…and I find no contradiction within Bonita’s posts or text. Finaliters are Trinity Embraced….we finaliters are embraced by the Trinity (such ones would be transformed by the process). Guardians (and others) are Creature Trinitized and are created by a non-sexual liaison by Trinitized Creatures….they are new beings created by trinitized creatures. Like I said before, think of how midwayers come to be. There’s an attempt here to homogenize all trinitization and that’s not what’s being described at all. Bonita’s post indicates these Guardians will accompany finaliters to the outer levels once the Supreme is completed by the current time and space experiential perfecting adventure. Deity trinitized Sons are created by Deity trinitization. Finaliters already exist but once embraced by Trinity (trinitization), they too may cocreate and procreate….the Guardians are one such form described as being created by such procreation by those in the Corps of Finality who have been Trinity embraced. I think the text is clear enough and describes an exciting potential for Agondonters especially!!

BB
Brooklyn_bornParticipant
Aug 19, 2017, 10:23 PM
I’d suggest you do a little more research, Bradly, as it seems you are struggling with your understanding of trinitization vs. trinity origin. There are some good papers on the two. I can supply several for starters if you are seriously interested.

BB
BonitaParticipant
Aug 19, 2017, 10:31 PM
I like what Bradly said. I’m convinced he’s right. Brand spanking new critters is what the Celestial Guardians are. Makes perfect sense. I have no need to discuss it any further. I’m satisfied with this revelation.

I knew that members of the Corps of the Finality could create entirely new personalities, but I didn’t realize they were Trinitized Sons of God. Hadn’t put two and two together, mostly because I hadn’t spent any time thinking about it. Thanks for bringing it up BB. It’s been a worthwhile study. There’s always something new and exciting to learn from TUB, which is why there’s no end to study.
Brooklyn_bornParticipant
Aug 19, 2017, 10:33 PM

LMAO!!!!!!

Bonita wrote:

I like what Bradly said. I’m convinced he’s right. Brand spanking new critters is what the Celestial Guardians are. Makes perfect sense. I have no need to discuss it any further. I’m satisfied with this revelation. I knew that members of the Corps of the Finality could create entirely new personalities, but I didn’t realize they were Trinitized Sons of God. Hadn’t put two and two together, mostly because I hadn’t spent any time thinking about it. Thanks for bringing it up BB. It’s been a worthwhile study. There’s always something new and exciting to learn from TUB, which is why there’s no end to study.

BB
BradlyParticipant
Aug 21, 2017, 2:08 AM

Brooklyn_born wrote:

I’d suggest you do a little more research, Bradly, as it seems you are struggling with your understanding of trinitization vs. trinity origin. There are some good papers on the two. I can supply several for starters if you are seriously interested.

Always happy to do research and get help with my understanding…seriously interested! Perhaps we should consider Paper 22 from the top!

Paper 22
The Trinitized Sons of God

22:0.1 (243.1) THERE are three groups of beings who are called Sons of God. In addition to descending and ascending orders of sonship there is a third group known as the Trinitized Sons of God. The trinitized order of sonship is subdivided into three primary divisions in accordance with the origins of its many types of personalities, revealed and unrevealed. These primary divisions are:

22:0.2 (243.2) 1. Deity-trinitized Sons.
22:0.3 (243.3) 2. Trinity-embraced Sons.
22:0.4 (243.4) 3. Creature-trinitized Sons.

22:0.5 (243.5) Irrespective of origin all Trinitized Sons of God have in common the experience of trinitization, either as a part of their origin or as an experience of Trinity embrace subsequently attained. The Deity-trinitized Sons are unrevealed in these narratives; therefore will this presentation be confined to a portrayal of the remaining two groups, more particularly the Trinity-embraced sons of God.

Trinitized origin is either Deity trinitized OR creature trinitized. Deity trinitized takes two forms – origin/creation OR embraced. Embraced is a transformative experience but then there is the creation/created/origination form of trinitization such as the Guardians are as Creature Trinitized. As we will learn once we work through the embraced-ones which include one time mortals, fused, and from the Corps of Finality.

"Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."
BradlyParticipant
Aug 21, 2017, 4:59 PM
There seems to be some confusion about trinitization. Trinitization takes two forms: creation of new beings or the transformation of existing beings. Those who are Creature Trinitized may then also be Trinitized Embraced….created by trinitization and then embraced by re-trinitization. Thus, we are provided with multiple ways that trinitization functions. Those created by trinitization are entirely new beings who are not Adjuster indwelt. I presume that those who are Deity Trinitized do not require re-trinitazation but those who are Creature Trinitized into new life, that re-trinitization offers another level of transformation to their being and capabilities.

Now to those who are not created by trinitization but are originally trinitized by embrace (#’s 1-5) and those two listed here as Creature Trinitized (#’s 6-7) but not Deity Trinitized (with some of these subject to re-trinitization):

1. The Trinity-Embraced Sons

22:1.1 (243.6) All Trinity-embraced sons are originally of dual or single origin, but subsequent to the Trinity embrace they are forever devoted to Trinity service and assignment. This corps, as revealed and as organized for superuniverse service, embraces seven orders of personalities:

22:1.2 (243.7) 1. Mighty Messengers.
22:1.3 (243.8) 2. Those High in Authority.
22:1.4 (243.9) 3. Those without Name and Number.
22:1.5 (243.10) 4. Trinitized Custodians.
22:1.6 (243.11) 5. Trinitized Ambassadors.
22:1.7 (243.12) 6. Celestial Guardians.
22:1.8 (243.13) 7. High Son Assistants.

22:1.9 (243.14) These seven groups of personalities are further classified, according to origin, nature, and function, into three major divisions: the Trinitized Sons of Attainment, the Trinitized Sons of Selection, and the Trinitized Sons of Perfection.

22:1.10 (244.1) The Trinitized Sons of Attainment — the Mighty Messengers, Those High in Authority, and Those without Name and Number — are all Adjuster-fused ascendant mortals who have attained Paradise and the Corps of the Finality. But they are not finaliters; when they have been Trinity embraced, their names are removed from the finaliter roll call. The new sons of this order pass through specific courses of training, for comparatively short periods, on the circuit headquarters planets of the Havona circuits under the direction of the Eternals of Days. Thereafter they are assigned to the services of the Ancients of Days in the seven superuniverses.

22:1.11 (244.2) The Trinitized Sons of Selection embrace the Trinitized Custodians and the Trinitized Ambassadors. They are recruited from certain of the evolutionary seraphim and translated midway creatures who have traversed Havona and have attained Paradise, as well as from certain of the Spirit-fused and the Son-fused mortals who have likewise ascended to the central Isle of Light and Life. Subsequent to their embrace by the Paradise Trinity and after a brief training in Havona, the Trinitized Sons of Selection are assigned to the courts of the Ancients of Days.

22:1.12 (244.3) The Trinitized Sons of Perfection. The Celestial Guardians and their co-ordinates, the High Son Assistants, comprise a unique group of twice-trinitized personalities. They are the creature-trinitized sons of Paradise-Havona personalities or of perfected ascendant mortals who have long distinguished themselves in the Corps of the Finality. Some of these creature-trinitized sons, after service with the Supreme Executives of the Seven Master Spirits and after serving under the Trinity Teacher Sons, are retrinitized (embraced) by the Paradise Trinity and then commissioned to the courts of the Ancients of Days as Celestial Guardians and as High Son Assistants. Trinitized Sons of Perfection are assigned directly to the superuniverse service without further training.

Learning anything yet? Cool Beans if you ask me!! Although I did understand the text when BB pointed out his confusion, I did not remember from prior studies that some of us Agondonters will be creating new life (see 22:8.1 below but the Destiny Guardians are specifically named as created by Creature Trinitization – but there are far more orders of such new beings created or co-created by one time mortals) prior to the outer levels adventure to come. Opens lots of potential for our participation in the creations to come! Glory Be!

22:8.1 (251.5) In addition to the creature-trinitized sons considered in this narrative, there are numerous unrevealed orders of creature-trinitized beings — the diverse progeny of the multiple liaisons of seven finaliter corps and Paradise-Havona personalities. But all these creature-trinitized beings, revealed and unrevealed, are endowed with personality by the Universal Father.

"Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."
BradlyParticipant
Aug 21, 2017, 9:43 PM
So…I’m wondering if anyone would care to help me understand Trinity-Origin vs. Deity-Trinitized beings? I understand the differences between Trinity-Origin and Trinity Embraced beings and Creature-Trinitized beings. And what is the current and future roles such Trinitized Beings will and do fulfill?

Thanks to Midi for this contribution to the discussion:

(1280.3) 117:2.3 Consider the status of the creature-trinitized sons: They are born and live in the present universe age; they have personalities, together with mind and spirit endowments. They have experiences and the memory thereof, but they do not grow as do ascenders. It is our belief and understanding that these creature-trinitized sons, while they are in the present universe age, are really of the next universe age — the age which will follow the completion of the growth of the Supreme. Hence they are not in the Supreme as of his present status of incompleteness and consequent growth. Thus they are nonparticipating in the experiential growth of the present universe age, being held in reserve for the next universe age.

Further reading in Paper 117 provides some hints regarding the differentiation I am inquiring about:

117:2.4 (1280.4) My own order, the Mighty Messengers, being Trinity embraced, are nonparticipating in the growth of the present universe age. In a sense we are in status as of the preceding universe age as in fact are the Stationary Sons of the Trinity. One thing is certain: Our status is fixed by the Trinity embrace, and experience no longer eventuates in growth.

117:2.5 (1280.5) This is not true of the finaliters nor of any other of the evolutionary and experiential orders which are participants in the growth process of the Supreme. You mortals now living on Urantia who may aspire to Paradise attainment and finaliter status should understand that such a destiny is only realizable because you are in and of the Supreme, hence are participants in the cycle of the growth of the Supreme.

117:2.6 (1280.6) There will come an end sometime to the growth of the Supreme; his status will achieve completion (in the energy-spirit sense). This termination of the evolution of the Supreme will also witness the ending of creature evolution as a part of Supremacy. What kind of growth may characterize the universes of outer space, we do not know. But we are very sure that it will be something very different from anything that has been seen in the present age of the evolution of the seven superuniverses. It will undoubtedly be the function of the evolutionary citizens of the grand universe to compensate the outer-spacers for this deprivation of the growth of Supremacy.

117:2.7 (1280.7) As existent upon the consummation of the present universe age, the Supreme Being will function as an experiential sovereign in the grand universe. Outer-spacers — citizens of the next universe age — will have a postsuperuniverse growth potential, a capacity for evolutionary attainment presupposing the sovereignty of the Almighty Supreme, hence excluding creature participation in the power-personality synthesis of the present universe age.

117:2.8 (1281.1) Thus may the incompleteness of the Supreme be regarded as a virtue since it makes possible the evolutionary growth of the creature-creation of the present universes. Emptiness does have its virtue, for it may become experientially filled.

Paper 117 ends with this:

117:7.17 (1293.1) The perfected grand universe of those future days will be vastly different from what it is at present. Gone will be the thrilling adventures of the organization of the galaxies of space, the planting of life on the uncertain worlds of time, and the evolving of harmony out of chaos, beauty out of potentials, truth out of meanings, and goodness out of values. The time universes will have achieved the fulfillment of finite destiny! And perhaps for a space there will be rest, relaxation from the agelong struggle for evolutionary perfection. But not for long! Certainly, surely, and inexorably the enigma of the emerging Deity of God the Ultimate will challenge these perfected citizens of the settled universes just as their struggling evolutionary forebears were once challenged by the quest for God the Supreme. The curtain of cosmic destiny will draw back to reveal the transcendent grandeur of the alluring absonite quest for the attainment of the Universal Father on those new and higher levels revealed in the ultimate of creature experience.
117:7.18 (1293.2) [Sponsored by a Mighty Messenger temporarily sojourning on Urantia.]

So…how are those who are Trinity Embraced from evolutionary time and the Creature-Trinitized and those who are re-trinitized involved in the current affairs of time and space….and what might be their role once the Supreme if fulfilled in time to come?

This has been a thrilling session of discovery for me….out destiny potential as one time tadpoles. What a glorious blessing to be thankful for!

"Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."
Nigel NunnParticipant
Aug 22, 2017, 2:44 AM
Hi BB — you wrote:

However, we have yet to satisfactorily address the revelator’s statement on celestial guardians never having been Adjuster indwelt (perhaps infused is what is meant). I find that problematic as there is no direct explanation why mortals are included. The only logical explanation I can come up with is that the previous life is stricken from the records once transformation occurs.

You began by pointing us to this paragraph:

(210.7) 18:4.4 “[…] But much of the routine work of major sector affairs is carried on by the Celestial Guardians and the High Son Assistants. These two groups are drawn from among the trinitized offspring of either Paradise-Havona personalities or glorified mortal finaliters. Certain of these two orders of creature-trinitized beings are retrinitized by the Paradise Deities and then are dispatched to assist in the administration of the superuniverse governments.”

Looks like you’ve simply misread the bit about the PARENTS of these “trinitized offspring“. Notice these parents can be EITHER “Paradise-Havona personalities” OR “glorified mortal finaliters“. Your confusion may come from not understanding how these “glorified mortal finaliters” give rise to a “creature-trinitized son”.

To help get you started, below are 4 paragraphs that set the stage.

Regarding re-trinitization of these “creature-trinitized sons”, those “creature-trinitized sons” (Celestial Guardians, High Son Assistants) who perform well can be “retrinitized by the Paradise Deities” (18:4.4) for work in other domains.

(PS: just wondering, are you trying to study these papers on a small screen? This may help to explain why you so regularly misread, then veer off into byways of confusion.)

Nevertheless, please do read about the utterly unimaginable experience that two mortal finaliters can enjoy.

From 22:7, “Technique of Trinitization”

(249.5) 22:7.5 If two mortal finaliters, on going before the Architects of the Master Universe, demonstrate that they have independently chosen an identical concept for trinitization, the Architects are empowered, on their own discretion, to promulgate mandates permitting these glorified mortal ascenders to extend their recess and to remove themselves for a time to the trinitizing sector of the Paradise Citizens. At the end of this assigned retreat, if they report that they have singly and jointly elected to make the paradisiacal effort to spiritualize, idealize, and actualize a selected and original concept which has not theretofore been trinitized, then does Master Spirit Number Seven issue orders authorizing such an extraordinary undertaking.

(249.6) 22:7.6 Unbelievably long periods of time are sometimes consumed in these adventures; an age seems to pass before these faithful and determined onetime mortals — and sometimes Paradise-Havona personalities — finally achieve their goal, really succeed in bringing their chosen concept of universal truth into actual being. And not always do these devoted couples meet with success; many times they fail, and that through no discoverable error on their part. Candidates for trinitization who thus fail are admitted to a special group of finaliters who are designated as beings who have made the supreme effort and sustained the supreme disappointment. When the Paradise Deities unite to trinitize, they always succeed, but not so with a homogeneous pair of creatures, the attempted union of two members of the same order of being.

(250.1) 22:7.7 When a new and original being is trinitized by the Gods, the divine parents are in deity potential unchanged; but when exalted creature beings enact such a creative episode, one of the contracting and participating individuals undergoes a unique personality modification. The two ancestors of a creature-trinitized son become in a certain sense spiritually as one. We believe that this status of bi-unification of certain spiritual phases of personality will probably prevail until such time as the Supreme Being shall have attained full and completed manifestation of personality in the grand universe.

(250.2) 22:7.8 Simultaneously with the appearance of a new creature-trinitized son, there occurs this functional spiritual union of the two ancestors; the two trinitizing parents become one on the ultimate functional level. No created being in the universe can fully explain this amazing phenomenon; it is a near-divine experience. When the Father and the Son united to eternalize the Infinite Spirit, upon the accomplishment of their purpose they immediately became as one and ever since have been one. And while the trinitization union of two creatures is on the order of the infinite scope of the perfect Deity union of the Universal Father and the Eternal Son, the repercussions of creature trinitization are not eternal in nature; they will terminate upon the completed factualization of the experiential Deities

[continued…]

Nigel
BradlyParticipant
Aug 22, 2017, 5:02 PM
Apparently BB is engaged otherwise for a season. Until he returns and acknowledges the solutions provided regarding his confusions on this matter, I wonder Nigel if you’d comment on trinitization and the roles and relationships of trinitized creatures to the Supreme and time and space creation? Also interested in anyone else’s thoughts on the issue too!

Thanks!

"Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."
AnonymousInactive
Aug 22, 2017, 5:43 PM
As Nigel, again re-posted the following UB narration, in order to better decipher the various meanings or definitions of the multiple trinitized being, it would be helpful to understand how this union can spawn an offspring.

Nigel Nunn wrote:

(250.1) 22:7.7 When a new and original being is trinitized by the Gods, the divine parents are in deity potential unchanged; but when exalted creature beings enact such a creative episode, one of the contracting and participating individuals undergoes a unique personality modification. The two ancestors of a creature-trinitized son become in a certain sense spiritually as one. We believe that this status of bi-unification of certain spiritual phases of personality will probably prevail until such time as the Supreme Being shall have attained full and completed manifestation of personality in the grand universe.

I have modified the quote above in order to emphasize some specific areas where primarily “bi-unification”, where the following section in the UB may explain this process a little more, and may foster additional ideas as to the creation of trinitized beings.

3. Spiritual Unification

(639.1) 56:3.1 As the universal mind gravity is centered in the Paradise personal presence of the Infinite Spirit, so does the universal spirit gravity center in the Paradise personal presence of the Eternal Son. The Universal Father is one, but to time-space he is revealed in the dual phenomena of pure energy and pure spirit.

(639.2) 56:3.2 Paradise spirit realities are likewise one, but in all time-space situations and relations this single spirit is revealed in the dual phenomena of the spirit personalities and emanations of the Eternal Son and the spirit personalities and influences of the Infinite Spirit and associated creations; and there is yet a third — pure-spirit fragmentations — the Father’s bestowal of the Thought Adjusters and other spirit entities which are prepersonal.

(639.3) 56:3.3 No matter on what level of universe activities you may encounter spiritual phenomena or contact with spirit beings, you may know that they are all derived from the God who is spirit by the ministry of the Spirit Son and the Infinite Mind Spirit. And this far-flung spirit functions as a phenomenon on the evolutionary worlds of time as it is directed from the headquarters of the local universes. From these capitals of the Creator Sons come the Holy Spirit and the Spirit of Truth, together with the ministry of the adjutant mind-spirits, to the lower and evolving levels of material minds. [a trinity of spirits]

(639.4) 56:3.4 While mind is more unified on the level of the Master Spirits in association with the Supreme Being and as the cosmic mind in subordination to the Absolute Mind, the spirit ministry to the evolving worlds is more directly unified in the personalities resident on the headquarters of the local universes and in the persons of the presiding Divine Ministers, who are in turn well-nigh perfectly correlated with the Paradise gravity circuit of the Eternal Son, wherein occurs final unification of all time-space spirit manifestations.

(639.5) 56:3.5 Perfected creature existence can be attained, sustained, and eternalized by the fusion of selfconscious mind with a fragment of the pre-Trinity spirit endowment of some one of the persons of the Paradise Trinity. The mortal mind is the creation of the Sons and Daughters of the Eternal Son and the Infinite Spirit and, when fused with the Thought Adjuster from the Father, partakes of the threefold spirit endowment of the evolutionary realms. But these three spirit expressions become perfectly unified in the finaliters, even as they were in eternity so unified in the Universal I AM ere he ever became the Universal Father of the Eternal Son and the Infinite Spirit.

(639.6) 56:3.6 Spirit must always and ultimately become threefold in expression and Trinity-unified in final realization. Spirit originates from one source through a threefold expression; and in finality it must and does attain its full realization in that divine unification which is experienced in finding God — oneness with divinity — in eternity, and by means of the ministry of the cosmic mind of the infinite expression of the eternal word of the Father’s universal thought.

As is mentioned in the re-post of the UB narration above, it also indicates a “unique personality modification”, where the following UB section may also apply slightly:

4. Personality Unification

(639.7) 56:4.1 The Universal Father is a divinely unified personality; hence will all his ascendant children who are carried to Paradise by the rebound momentum of the Thought Adjusters, who went forth from Paradise to indwell material mortals in obedience to the Father’s mandate, likewise be fully unified personalities ere they reach Havona.

(640.1) 56:4.2 Personality inherently reaches out to unify all constituent realities. The infinite personality of the First Source and Center, the Universal Father, unifies all seven constituent Absolutes of Infinity; and the personality of mortal man, being an exclusive and direct bestowal of the Universal Father, likewise possesses the potential of unifying the constituent factors of the mortal creature. Such unifying creativity of all creature personality is a birthmark of its high and exclusive source and is further evidential of its unbroken contact with this same source through the personality circuit, by means of which the personality of the creature maintains direct and sustaining contact with the Father of all personality on Paradise.

(640.2) 56:4.3 Notwithstanding that God is manifest from the domains of the Sevenfold up through supremacy and ultimacy to God the Absolute, the personality circuit, centering on Paradise and in the person of God the Father, provides for the complete and perfect unification of all these diverse expressions of divine personality so far as concerns all creature personalities on all levels of intelligent existence and in all the realms of the perfect, perfected, and perfecting universes.

(640.3) 56:4.4 While God is to and in the universes all that we have portrayed, nevertheless, to you and to all other God-knowing creatures he is one, your Father and their Father. To personality God cannot be plural. God is Father to each of his creatures, and it is literally impossible for any child to have more than one father.

(640.4) 56:4.5 Philosophically, cosmically, and with reference to differential levels and locations of manifestation, you may and perforce must conceive of the functioning of plural Deities and postulate the existence of plural Trinities; but in the worshipful experience of the personal contact of every worshiping personality throughout the master universe, God is one; and that unified and personal Deity is our Paradise parent, God the Father, the bestower, conservator, and Father of all personalities from mortal man on the inhabited worlds to the Eternal Son on the central Isle of Light.
BonitaParticipant
Aug 23, 2017, 3:13 PM

Bradly wrote:

So…I’m wondering if anyone would care to help me understand Trinity-Origin vs. Deity-Trinitized beings?

Shouldn’t we begin by answering the question: What is the purpose of trinitization? We know that it can be accomplished by different persons, but why?

As I understand, at this moment of time and subject to change, is that those beings who are trinitized by some member of the Trinity have the authority to represent the Trinity as “vicegerents of the Gods” (13:1.12). However, persons trinitized by creatures can represent the God’s concerning one concept and all the Trinity-related potentials, in this current age, of that particular concept. Don’t forget that the Trinity is Thought, Word and Action. Trinitization, as best I can figure, has to do with the oneness of all three, either on the Deity level (trinitized by a member of the Trinity) or the creature level (trinitized by creatures). It seems logical to me that creature-trinitization involves a specific concept in all its potential, whereas Deity-trinitization involves a much broader scope of potential. My ideas on this are a work in progress, so feel free to criticize.
BradlyParticipant
Aug 23, 2017, 4:51 PM
Okay…here we go!!

13:1.11 (145.6) 4. VICEGERINGTON. This planet is the “bosom of the Father and the Son” and is the secret sphere of certain unrevealed beings who take origin by the acts of the Father and the Son. This is also the Paradise home of many glorified beings of complex ancestry, those whose origin is complicated because of the many diverse techniques operative in the seven superuniverses. Many groups of beings forgather on this world whose identity has not been revealed to Urantia mortals.

13:1.12 (146.1) The secrets of Vicegerington include the secrets of trinitization, and trinitization constitutes the secret of authority to represent the Trinity, to act as vicegerents of the Gods. Authority to represent the Trinity attaches only to those beings, revealed and unrevealed, who are trinitized, created, eventuated, or eternalized by any two or all three of the Paradise Trinity. Personalities brought into being by the trinitizing acts of certain types of glorified creatures represent no more than the conceptual potential mobilized in that trinitization, albeit such creatures may ascend the path of Deity embrace open to all of their kind.

13:1.13 (146.2) Nontrinitized beings do not fully understand the technique of trinitization by either two or three Creators or by certain creatures. You will never fully understand such a phenomenon unless, in the far-distant future of your glorified career, you should essay and succeed in such an adventure, because otherwise these secrets of Vicegerington will always be forbidden you. But to me, a high Trinity-origin being, all sectors of Vicegerington are open. I fully understand, and just as fully and sacredly protect, the secret of my origin and destiny.

13:1.14 (146.3) There are still other forms and phases of trinitization which have not been brought to the notice of the Urantia peoples, and these experiences, in their personal aspects, are duly protected in the secret sector of Vicegerington.

"Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."
BonitaParticipant
Aug 23, 2017, 4:59 PM
I know Bradly. I already read those quotes. What are your thoughts on them?
BradlyParticipant
Aug 23, 2017, 5:53 PM
Busy right now but thinking about it. I looked up the definition and origin of vicegerent to help me understand the role better. It seems that one must be of Trinity Origin or Trinitized Origin and/or Embraced to represent the Trinity both in the universes of time and space and the future outer levels? And the role appears vitally important in the adventures to come. Especially so, perhaps, the ascending and descending Son Embrace.

noun
1. an officer appointed as deputy by and to a sovereign or supreme chief.
2. a deputy in general.

adjective
3. exercising delegated powers.
4. characterized by delegation of powers.

Origin of vicegerent

1530-40; < New Latin vicegerent- (stem of vicegerēns managing instead of), equivalent to Latin vice (see vice3) + gerent- (stem of gerēns, present participle of gerere to carry on, conduct); see -ent

"Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."

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