32 posts · 8 participants · started Sep 2, 2021, 4:04 PM
Combien de temps met un séraphin qui transporte une âme qui survie et vas sur le monde des maisons 1 ?
sachant que la vitesse maxi d’un séraphin est de 3x la vitesse la lumière
Est-ce la même vitesse si il s’agit d’une âme décédée, ou d’un transport d’une personnalité enséraphiné
ou bien utilise t- il un autre circuit plus rapide, sachant que Satania se trouve à plusieurs millions d’années lumière de Urantia (au bas mots 50 millions environ)
Jean
Combien de temps met un séraphin qui transporte une âme qui survie et vas sur le monde des maisons 1 ? sachant que la vitesse maxi d’un séraphin est de 3x la vitesse la lumière Est-ce la même vitesse si il s’agit d’une âme décédée, ou d’un transport d’une personnalité enséraphiné ou bien utilise t- il un autre circuit plus rapide, sachant que Satania se trouve à plusieurs millions d’années lumière de Urantia (au bas mots 50 millions environ) Jean
Welcome to the forum Jean. Your questions and comments are translated as follows:
How long does it take for a seraph carrying a soul that survives and goes
to the world of houses 1?
knowing that the maximum speed of a seraph is 3x the speed of light
Is it the same speed if it is a dead soul, or a transport of a seraphinized
personality?
or is he using another, faster circuit, knowing that Satania is several million
light years from Urantia (at least 50 million or so)
I’m not an expert, but I found this reference, among others, for consideration on the length of time the guardian seraphim use to get a sleeping survivor to Mansonia.
30:4.11 2. Sleeping Survivors. All mortals of survival status, in the custody of personal guardians of destiny, pass through the portals of natural death and, on the third period, personalize on the mansion worlds. Those accredited beings who have, for any reason, been unable to attain that level of intelligence mastery and endowment of spirituality which would entitle them to personal guardians, cannot thus immediately and directly go to the mansion worlds. Such surviving souls must rest in unconscious sleep until the judgment day of a new epoch, a new dispensation, the coming of a Son of God to call the rolls of the age and adjudicate the realm, and this is the general practice throughout all Nebadon. It was said of Christ Michael that, when he ascended on high at the conclusion of his work on earth, “He led a great multitude of captives.” And these captives were the sleeping survivors from the days of Adam to the day of the Master’s resurrection on Urantia.
What constitutes “the third period”? Is it the third day?
The ones who are not taken to Mansonia on the third period remain on the natal planet, until the next dispensational roll call. The Adamic roll call occurred while Christ Michael in morontia form was on earth.
189:3.1 [Part IV]A little after half past four o’clock this Sunday morning, Gabriel summoned the archangels to his side and made ready to inaugurate the general resurrection of the termination of the Adamic dispensation on Urantia. When the vast host of the seraphim and the cherubim concerned in this great event had been marshaled in proper formation, the morontia Michael appeared before Gabriel, saying: “As my Father has life in himself, so has he given it to the Son to have life in himself. Although I have not yet fully resumed the exercise of universe jurisdiction, this self-imposed limitation does not in any manner restrict the bestowal of life upon my sleeping sons; let the roll call of the planetary resurrection begin.”
23:3.2 The universe is well supplied with spirits who utilize gravity for purposes of transit; they can go anywhere any time — instanter — but they are not persons. Certain other gravity traversers are personal beings, such as Gravity Messengers and Transcendental Recorders, but they are not available to the super- and the local universe administrators. The worlds teem with angels and men and other highly personal beings, but they are handicapped by time and space: The limit of velocity for most nonenseraphimed beings is 186,280 miles of your world per second of your time; the midway creatures and certain others can, often do, attain double velocity — 372,560 miles per second — while the seraphim and others can traverse space at triple velocity, about 558,840 miles per second. There are, however, no transit or messenger personalities who function between the instantaneous velocities of the gravity traversers and the comparatively slow speeds of the seraphim, except the Solitary Messengers.
Ok, mais quoi penser de cette phrase
Si vos intentions et vos désirs ont une valeur de survie, des décrets seront émis pour prolonger votre période probatoire. On vous allouera du temps supplémentaire pour démontrer ce que vous valez » (P.1233-§3).
« Si jamais il y a un doute sur l’opportunité de faire avancer une identité humaine vers les mondes des maisons, les gouvernements de l’univers décident invariablement dans l’intérêt personnel de l’individu. Sans hésiter, ils élèvent cette âme au statut d’être transitionnel, tout en continuant leurs observations sur ses intentions morontielles et ses desseins spirituels émergents. Ainsi, la divine justice est certaine d’être accomplie et la divine miséricorde se voit accorder une nouvelle occasion d’étendre son ministère » (P.1233-§4).
Yes, as your reference (P.1233) states:
112:5.7 If ever there is doubt as to the advisability of advancing a human identity to the mansion worlds, the universe governments invariably rule in the personal interests of that individual; they unhesitatingly advance such a soul to the status of a transitional being, while they continue their observations of the emerging morontia intent and spiritual purpose. Thus divine justice is certain of achievement, and divine mercy is accorded further opportunity for extending its ministry.
(1233.4) 112:5.8 The governments of Orvonton and Nebadon do not claim absolute perfection for the detail working of the universal plan of mortal repersonalization, but they do claim to, and actually do, manifest patience, tolerance, understanding, and merciful sympathy. We had rather assume the risk of a system rebellion than to court the hazard of depriving one struggling mortal from any evolutionary world of the eternal joy of pursuing the ascending career.
(1233.5) 112:5.9 This does not mean that human beings are to enjoy a second opportunity in the face of the rejection of a first, not at all. But it does signify that all will creatures are to experience one true opportunity to make one undoubted, self-conscious, and final choice. The sovereign Judges of the universes will not deprive any being of personality status who has not finally and fully made the eternal choice; the soul of man must and will be given full and ample opportunity to reveal its true intent and real purpose.
D’accord avec toi, mais cela ne réponds pas à la question: par quel moyen les séraphins parcours 50 millions d’années lumières en 3 jours ?
D’accord avec toi, mais cela ne réponds pas à la question: par quel moyen les séraphins parcours 50 millions d’années lumières en 3 jours ?
Back to my question: “What constitutes “the third period”? Is it the third day?”. Does a “period” equal 24 hours? I don’t know. What is a “period”?
Apparently there are power lines for communication and transport.
(322.1) 29:2.17 5. Constellation Centers. Ten of these living power centers are stationed in each constellation, functioning as energy projectors to the one hundred tributary local systems. From these beings there go forth the power lines for communication and transport and for the energizing of those living creatures who are dependent upon certain forms of physical energy for the maintenance of life. But neither the power centers nor the subordinate physical controllers are otherwise concerned with life as a functional organization.
29:4.14 The physical controllers are chiefly occupied in the adjustment of basic energies undiscovered on Urantia. These unknown energies are very essential to the interplanetary system of transport and to certain techniques of communication. When we lay lines of energy for the purpose of conveying sound equivalents or of extending vision, these undiscovered forms of energy are utilized by the living physical controllers and their associates. These same energies are also, on occasion, used by the midway creatures in their routine work.
Salut Mara,
Je serais enclin à croire qu’ils utilisent un système de transport non révélé dans le LU.
Pour moi 3 périodes correspondent à 3 jours d’Urantia.
Amitié, Jean
I think we have a translation problem or number of zeroes problem. It is not 50 million light years to anywhere I don’t think. Certainly not to the system capital.
Need the text please!
It is 250,000 light years from Jerusem to center of the Super Universe….
32:2.11 (359.8) The Satania system of inhabited worlds is far removed from Uversa and that great sun cluster which functions as the physical or astronomic center of the seventh superuniverse. From Jerusem, the headquarters of Satania, it is over two hundred thousand light-years to the physical center of the superuniverse of Orvonton, far, far away in the dense diameter of the Milky Way. Satania is on the periphery of the local universe, and Nebadon is now well out towards the edge of Orvonton. From the outermost system of inhabited worlds to the center of the superuniverse is a trifle less than two hundred and fifty thousand light-years.
"Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."
Salut Bradly
Tu a raison, je me suis trompé, il s’agit de 50 ooo années lumière.
Jean
Greetings Jean!!
Unsure of my translation. My apologies.
No worries. Your point is valid. Even at 3 times the speed of sound, transport seraphim are as slow as sea turtles in space!
Glad you are here!!
Please post the distance quote! Cannot find it.
"Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."
Tu a raison, je me suis trompé, il s’agit de 50 ooo années lumière.
I am not convinced that the architectural worlds of Satania are 50,000 (more or less) light-years away. Can you or someone else help us with this? I have other questions too.
Thank you Jean for brining your question to the forum.
I am not convinced that the architectural worlds of Satania are 50,000 (more or less) light-years away. Can you or someone else help us with this? I have other questions too.
From Paper 41:3.1:
“There are upward of two thousand brilliant suns pouring forth light and energy in Satania, …” (458.1, 41:3.1)
This 1998 NASA page, local star counts states there are 2,127 stars within 65 light years (20 parsecs) from Earth. So if Satania contains about two thousand stars, then the distance from here to Jerusem might be 10 to 20 light years?
Nigel
Salut Nigel
Merci pour tes précisions, en fait j’ai confondu la distance de Jérusem au centre du superunivers avec la distance du système le plus éloigné, (d’où mon erreur de 50 000 années lumière).
Supposons qu’il y ai 10 années lumière de Urantia à Jérusem, à 3x la vitesse de la lumière, un séraphin mettrai environ 3 années pour rejoindre Jérusem!!! on est encore loin de 3 jours, à moins que “un moment ou un jour” ne corresponde en fait à une année.
Creusons encore, nous trouverons certainement une réponse satisfaisante.
Ceci n’est pas très important au vu du long voyage qui nous attends pour rejoindre la source centre première, mais j’aime chercher dans les détails.
A+
Pour moi 3 périodes correspondent à 3 jours d’Urantia.
They plainly say,
(569.4) 49:6.9 Throughout the earlier ages of an evolutionary world, few mortals go to judgment on the third day. But as the ages pass, more and more the personal guardians of destiny are assigned to the advancing mortals, and thus increasing numbers of these evolving creatures are repersonalized on the first mansion world on the third day after natural death. On such occasions the return of the Adjuster signalizes the awakening of the human soul, and this is the repersonalization of the dead just as literally as when the en masse roll is called at the end of a dispensation on the evolutionary worlds.
More details are given here with a reference to “the third pariod”,
112:4.13 If the human individual survives without delay, the Adjuster, so I am instructed, registers at Divinington, proceeds to the Paradise presence of the Universal Father, returns immediately and is embraced by the Personalized Adjusters of the superuniverse and local universe of assignment, receives the recognition of the chief Personalized Monitor of Divinington, and then, at once, passes into the “realization of identity transition,” being summoned therefrom on the third period and on the mansion world in the actual personality form made ready for the reception of the surviving soul of the earth mortal as that form has been projected by the guardian of destiny.
And here they talk about reassembly on the third period,
112:5.15 During the transit of surviving mortals from the world of origin to the mansion worlds, whether they experience personality reassembly on the third period or ascend at the time of a group resurrection, the record of personality constitution is faithfully preserved by the archangels on their worlds of special activities. These beings are not the custodians of personality (as the guardian seraphim are of the soul), but it is nonetheless true that every identifiable factor of personality is effectually safeguarded in the custody of these dependable trustees of mortal survival. As to the exact whereabouts of mortal personality during the time intervening between death and survival, we do not know.
(Earlier I edited the above reply and for some reason the reply was duplicated. So I erased it just now.)
Thanks Mara. Yes a “day” is a different frequency on every world, no matter which System. So the Jerusem “period” (which is not determined by any orbit or star relationship) must be the standard.
So…3 Jerusem periods allows for over 400 billion straight line miles of seraphic transport. Perhaps further if there is a shorter distance between two points than a straight line? Are there space curvature or time warps or distance portals or some other forms of physics shortcuts for such distance traversal?
"Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."
This 1998 NASA page, local star counts states there are 2,127 stars within 65 light years (20 parsecs) from Earth. So if Satania contains about two thousand stars, then the distance from here to Jerusem might be 10 to 20 light years?
One light-year is about 6 trillion miles (9 trillion km). That is a 6 with 12 zeros behind it! I assume that in time-space universes the speed of light does not vary among universes/systems. I imagine the variety of sizes of peopled planets within our system, each one designating their time units according to their understanding of how their orb moves through space (rotational axis and orbital rotation around a sun/s) over time.
But on our world using our time designations, a guardian seraphim can travel up to three times the distance light travels (3 X 6 trillion miles) in one year of our time, thus reducing down the travel time it takes to go somewhere to one third of the time it takes light to get to the same place. That’s pretty amazing!
But on our world a day is twenty-four hours. The question about what is a “day” and what is a “period” might not be helpful. Others can reason it out. But the UB designates a light year in terms familiar to earthlings. How far is Earth from Jerusem? Ten to twenty light years away maybe. Does this mean it will take seraphic transports one third of that time (3.3 light years up to 6.7 light years) to get from here to there?
Bradly wrote: So…3 Jerusem periods allows for over 400 billion straight line miles of seraphic transport.
I don’t see how you arrived at 400 billion miles of seraphic transport.. Can you explain? Thanks.
Correction: Speed of light times 9 local days.
186,000 miles per second x 60 sec. x 60 min. x 24 hrs. x 9 Urantia days = 144,633,600,000 miles in 3 Satania periods.
33:6.9 (372.4) The day in Satania, as reckoned on Jerusem, is a little less (1 hour, 4 minutes, 15 seconds) than three days of Urantia time. These times are generally known as Salvington or universe time, and Satania or system time. Standard time is universe time.
"Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."
186,000 miles per second x 60 sec. x 60 min. x 24 hrs. x 9 Urantia days = 144,633,600,000 miles in 3 Satania periods.
Oh okay. I got a similar number of miles (144,851,328,000 miles = 259,200 earth seconds in 3 earth days x 558,840 maximum miles per second velocity of seraphic transport), but both yours and mine are well under the distance light travels in one year (6,000,000,000,000 miles). If Nigel’s info is helpful in estimating the distance from earth to Jerusem, then our numbers are far off the mark. In other words it takes a very, very long time for transport seraphim to go to Mansonia.
But what’s the hurry? I want to go to Mansonia number one, because I do not want to miss out on a single bit of training!
Here is a supplemental reference:
23:3.2 The universe is well supplied with spirits who utilize gravity for purposes of transit; they can go anywhere any time — instanter — but they are not persons. Certain other gravity traversers are personal beings, such as Gravity Messengers and Transcendental Recorders, but they are not available to the super- and the local universe administrators. The worlds teem with angels and men and other highly personal beings, but they are handicapped by time and space: The limit of velocity for most nonenseraphimed beings is 186,280 miles of your world per second of your time; the midway creatures and certain others can, often do, attain double velocity — 372,560 miles per second — while the seraphim and others can traverse space at triple velocity, about 558,840 miles per second. There are, however, no transit or messenger personalities who function between the instantaneous velocities of the gravity traversers and the comparatively slow speeds of the seraphim, except the Solitary Messengers.
Neat how they call 3 times the speed of light “comparatively slow”
