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Spiritual insight

55 posts · 5 participants · started Aug 8, 2014, 10:43 PM

  1. Bradly wrote:  Many have been “converted” by might and much evil has resulted from believing the end justifies all means.
    Isn’t that due to a breakdown in interpretation and intention of choice (discover, recognize interpret and choose)?  Those who wish to convert have discovered and recognized something they believe has value.  Being motivated within their souls to interpret that value , they interpret it erroneously to mean that it should have the same exact value and meaning for everyone.  The intention is then to convert through force because that is the only way to get another person to adopt your personal interpretation of value.  The ends don’t work because the means are not true.  Each person must come to their own interpretation with help from the Spirit of Truth.
    I would say that it represents a breakdown at the moral level-2.   Forcing (might) a personal need or desire upon another person because it is deemed “right,” when it actually is a  misinterpretation of reality, an error.  And error is evil, impartial or incomplete understanding, a misinterpretation of a recognized reality, a maladjustment to reality.
    67:1.4 Error might be regarded as a misconception or distortion of reality. Evil is a partial realization of, or maladjustment to, universe realities.
  2. I thought it best to approach the problem of understanding the revealed concept of spiritual insight by dealing first with the revealed concepts of material and moral insight.

    Bonita – my point is simple agreement with Reader’s assertion that it takes moral insight, I would argue actual Spirit insight/intuition to come to realize these truths – material power cannot make “right” or rightness or righteousness and the end, no matter how righteous itself, can never justify the unrighteous means to attain it.  This is far beyond ethics….or even morals IMO.

    "Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."

  3. Bradly wrote:  Bonita – my point is simple agreement with Reader’s assertion that it takes moral insight, I would argue actual Spirit insight/intuition to come to realize these truths
    That’s my point too.  Interpretation is a soul function made possible by the Spirit of Truth (all about relations, remember?).  A failure at that level would not allow the mind to realize level-3.  Stuck at level-2 it becomes a misinterpretation of  the true meaning of right and wrong.  I’m talking about the process within the mind and soul.  Isn’t this topic about personality association with the cosmic mind and its relation to spiritual insight? I keep trying to explain how it works but I don’t think anyone understands or believes me.
    When it comes to insight, all a personality can do is discover, recognize, interpret and choose (196:3.10).  We do these same steps on all three levels of universe reality. The reality recognition response of the cosmic mind on each level of reality is the “recognize” part of discover, recognize, interpret and choose.   When all three levels of reality are discovered, recognized, interpreted and chosen, they become unified and part of a strong, stable character.  If there is a failure at any level, the result is disproportionality due to the unrelatedness of their respective functions.  Disproportion results in instability and error.  It’s impartial adaptation to reality recognition, a failure to unify all three levels of reality, and that is imperfection, failure to be perfected.

  4. The reality recognition response of the cosmic mind on each level of reality is the “recognize” part of discover, recognize, interpret and choose. When all three levels of reality are discovered, recognized, interpreted and chosen, they become unified and part of a strong, stable character. If there is a failure at any level, the result is disproportionality due to the unrelatedness of their respective functions. Disproportion results in instability and error. It’s impartial adaptation to reality recognition, a failure to unify all three levels of reality, and that is imperfection, failure to be perfected.

    For my part Bonita, I assure you that disbelief is not an issue for me, but my inability to understand much is legendary, and I appreciate the patience you and Reader both extend to me and those of us who are challenged intellectually to grasp some concepts and relationships.  I’ve never allowed my apparent ignorance or blindness to get in the way of my curiosity and desire to transcend both.   Though humble, I have courage enough to not fear appearing either ignorant or even foolish to pursue and gain knowledge and truth.

    Spiritual insight began for me in the study of the universal and original law of karma – the law of cause (choice) and effect (result).  This law of reciprocity has been diminished over time to represent material outcomes too often.  The result of choice is mindal and spiritual – either progressively or regressively.  Choice has effect – immediate and lasting effect – in-mind.  We are the result of our choices.  This is neither ethical or moral and requires an insight that is not material minded in source but, rather, spiritual insight – recognition/discernment and then the application of will to choose according to this insight of universal truth – which has no material source or demonstration.

    I have long characterized choices in 4 distinct categories to guide my decisions in all things:

    1.  Do the right thing for the right reason.

    2.  Do the wrong thing but for the right reason.

    3.  Do the right thing but for the wrong reason.

    4.  Do the wrong thing and for the wrong reason.

    These are the mortal mind choice options.  Jesus demonstrated the ultimate choice option:  Do the best thing for the best reason.  Something for ascenders to aspire to but not something we have the ability to  achieve without far more experience, wisdom, and I think, fusion with TA, and maybe not even until Finality.

    Reader’s position on might does not make right is a recognition of the inferiority of #2 and the superiority of #1 and also demonstrates the reality that no end justifies any means – it is the means that results in the end.  This is quite insightful and on a non-material level.  And I agree such truth comes by many circuits – all spiritual.

    ;-)

    "Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."

  5. Bradly wrote: . . . no end justifies any means
    Isn’t it also about ascending levels of cosmic wisdom . . . learning what ends are worth striving for and which means are appropriate for the situation?  Animals do that by trial and error; but because of insight, humans can think about cause and effect before acting.  This is a mind process, assisted by the cosmic mind in conjunction with the spirit presence within the mind.  Isn’t it about selective discrimination which allows for the identification of superior ends?  Once identified, discovering the highest level of morality with which to attain those ends becomes the goal.   And wouldn’t that always come down to doing God’s will?
    146:2.14  Jesus taught that the prayer for divine guidance over the pathway of earthly life was next in importance to the petition for a knowledge of the Father’s will. In reality this means a prayer for divine wisdom. 
  6. I also think that alignment with God’s will begins with recognizing the power of “self” alignment first which requires cognition, experience, and some wisdom.  Each mortal mind has morals/values, priorities, goals, and choices.  Frustration, failure, and even unhappiness I think often result from inconsistency and misalignment of these factors which bring great power and momentum when properly aligned.  This is true on a purely material level.  Effective people have internal alignment, balance, and harmonization of these elements.

    Spirit progress requires another level of alignment, as you say Bonita.  The values and the goals must become Spirit directed for the effective mind to then transcend the material world…..thus we begin to transfer the seat of identity.  We cannot even begin this process without spiritual insight, personal alignment with spiritual values, and then the discernment of the results of choice by experience.  There are two forms of identifiable reality response I think:  the first are the fruits; but the other is a function of directional momentum – new choices and new forms of opportunities for error.  Life is a short loop or circuit, making the same mistakes over and over, or, it is progressive bringing new choices requiring the application of prior progress made.  Can’t get new choices until the old choices are made and made well and correctly and verified by experience and recognized by mind…..ascending levels of cosmic wisdom indeed.

    "Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."

  7. Bradley’s list of the four flavors of choice-making reminds me of the limitations of ‘mere moral’ discrimination.

    Under this ‘judicial form of discrimination’ (p.192) we are not without Adjuster aid, but it’s still in our laps, and we simply do the best we can by our best lights (including the consideration of as much adjuster warning as we can hear).

    Actually, choosing between right and wrong is usually a no-brainer; it is the choice between relative degrees of right and wrong in each situation which is the most usual and tougher challenge.

    And for new readers – when we read of  ‘the recognition of relative right and wrong’ we should know the author is referring not to ‘ethical relativity’ but to the discernible degree of difference in right and wrong between any two chcoices in any situation. Sometimes the lesser of two evils must be chosen. Sometimes our choice is between the greater of two goods. These are the tough ones.

  8. Bradly wrote:  We cannot even begin this process without spiritual insight, . . .
    Thank God it’s a gift then, huh?

    Bradly wrote:   There are two forms of identifiable reality response I think:  the first are the fruits; but the other is a function of directional momentum – new choices and new forms of opportunities for error.
    Oh that’s interesting!  Are you talking about outcomes? We are told that we have to repeat decisions over and over again in order to make them habitual, and as you say, I think that many of the learned decisions often show up in new circumstances which require us to give them a little tweaking to make them more perfect-like.
    In terms of experience and directional momentum, even though we go round and round the cosmic circles, I think there is directional movement upward and inward in any progressing individual.  We’re told that we leave a trail of actualized reality as we pass through ascending levels and that our personal modification of potential reality causes a reaction in the Supreme (117:5.6)  That’s a marvelous thing.  Once you get wind of that, you just want more.

  9.  

     

    Exactly. I think of it like a cork screw or slinky toy for the up and down part. Round and round but also up OR down.

    "Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."

  10. For lineal progression illustrated, stretch the slinky with space between the links. The faster the progress the more distance between each round and round.

    "Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."

  11. Reader wrote:  Under this ‘judicial form of discrimination’ (p.192) we are not without Adjuster aid, but it’s still in our laps, and we simply do the best we can by our best lights (including the consideration of as much adjuster warning as we can hear).
    I think we also have assistance from the two higher adjutants, particularly the spirit of wisdom, and the Holy Spirit.  We’re never really left without help of some kind.  It’s availing oneself of the help that is so important, and why more people don’t always mystifies me.
  12. Bradly wrote: For lineal progression illustrated, stretch the slinky with space between the links. The faster the progress the more distance between each round and round.
    But don’t you think we’re capable of creating knots and doubling back on the links.  I know I’ve had to untangle a few knots in my life . . . a little backward sliding occasionally  . . . always turns out to be a kick in the butt though.  I don’t think it’s a good thing to go too fast, but maybe I’m just the slow and easy type.
  13. I don’t think we can create “knots” that result in stasis, no.  I mean I can get my mind in a knot, no doubt – hahaha!  I used to think that people could just stand still, but Jesus said we are always moving closer or further away in Spirit, always….by every choice made, by every response made.  Spiritual insight is a function of or a fulcrum for response-ability I think.  If we always choose the same response, not only is there no progress, but another opportunity is lost – we lose ground, and are now further from progress – we regress by every bad or wrong choice.  Spirit gravity is always an increasing force or a decreasing force.  Such measurements may be miniscule, I have no clue.

    I also once thought that we progressed by our goals and our intentions, and in some small degree that may be true.  But I think we accelerate our progress when we relinquish the “plan” and the “strategies” and real-ize that what we’re really here to learn is how to respond to every intersection of choice – whether good, bad, tragic, or mundane – we hurtle through a life of intersections, both events and relationships which demand a response.  How do we respond?  Why?  What underlays our decisions and our motives and our priorities and how do those improve or impair our response?  Some of us react.  And some of us feel our plans are threatened by what happens to us and around us.  Some of us depend so heavily upon the approval or actions of others and leave us so disappointed and so helpless.  Some of us are mired in the here and now of material attachments and define everything by its relation to our material comforts and wealth and pleasures.

    But some of us are learning to “look into” and “see” the nature of these intersections to discover the opportunity to discern and express the Spirit perspective – another opportunity to learn, to discover the better how to respond to every event and every encounter.  Some of us are soul builders and not accidental ones, but purposefully choosing.  As Reader pointed out so well – once we get past discerning good from bad (that would be pre-school level work as the TA arrives upon passing that first such examination or test), we must then begin to wrestle with moral dilemmas and the least bad and most good choices where such discernments are not nearly so easy.  And soon, we must real-ize the importance of such choosing to our own well being and the well being of others.  Are we “obedient” to avoid punishment?  Or are we kind and generous because of the fruit that arrives in mind and into soul by such wisdom?

    As you say Bonita, and the Revelation confirms, direction is far more important than speed.  It’s not a race or a timed event.  But you are always moving….one direction or the other I think.

    ;-)

    "Live loyally today—grow—and tomorrow will attend to itself. The quickest way for a tadpole to become a frog is to live loyally each moment as a tadpole."

  14. Bradly wrote: As you say Bonita, and the Revelation confirms, direction is far more important than speed.  It’s not a race or a timed event.  But you are always moving….one direction or the other I think.
    I agree Brad.  They say when the soul stops changing, it’s dead.  Not good.
    112:0.15  Personality may survive mortal death with identity in the surviving soul. The Adjuster and the personality are changeless; the relationship between them (in the soul) is nothing but change, continuing evolution; and if this change (growth) ceased, the soul would cease.
  15. Dears fellows,

    86:7.2 (956.5) Modern society is removing the business of insurance from the realm of priests and religion, placing it in the domain of economics. Religion is concerning itself increasingly with the insurance of life beyond the grave. Modern men, at least those who think, no longer pay wasteful premiums to control luck. Religion is slowly ascending to higher philosophic levels in contrast with its former function as a scheme of insurance against bad luck.

    How interesting !!!

    To succeed, to achieve thinking differently UB point out the direction. The spiritual forces ministrie carried us there. Only Divine’s demand, open the door and seat willingly inside the car.

    No wonder !

    To exercise thinking process from light to deep… from human to Divine. From finite to infinite.

    How could I look at human relative reality with God’s perfect point of view ?

    156:5.16  In the spirit, your citizenship is in heaven; in the flesh, you are still citizens of the earth kingdoms

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